Although he never said it, I believe my father was a bit disappointed that I didn’t follow in his footsteps sixty years ago. As an atheist even then, I felt I couldn’t in good conscience, apply for membership.
Only a belief in “God” is required, and God is a creator or higher power. I do not believe in any of the religions that have caused more pain and death than all other reasons combined. I however do believe there is a higher power, be it from here or elsewhere. The time will come when those who are ready will have the knowledge.
Only a belief in “God” is required, and God is a creator or higher power. I do not believe in any of the religions that have caused more pain and death than all other reasons combined. I however do believe there is a higher power, be it from here or elsewhere. The time will come when those who are ready will have the knowledge.
Those are the kinds of statements that will make skin crawl here. CFI is committed to basing belief on fact and reason. We can all believe whatever we want. To most of us here, that is not a responsible or sound basis for belief.
I’ll take it a step further. I presume that you’re a good person who is committed to helping others, being kind, etc. The problem that I have with what you’re saying is that it sounds like an excuse to believe whatever you want. You may not ever let that turn ugly but people do, all the time. Encouraging a culture that says it’s OK to believe whatever you want just because that’s what you want to believe facilitates arbitrary thinking and action. Eventually, in fact quite rapidly, you’re going to get people who are going to turn it ugly. Consider, for example, slavery in the United States, supposedly a country founded on a principle of freedom and universal inalienable rights. The only way that can happen is that people think they can believe whatever they want.
That’s why I have major problems with the intellectual content of your post. You’re new here and I don’t mean to attack you but at its core, the belief system you promote is irresponsible.
I did not realize Masonry required a belief in a ‘god’. I wonder how they would feel, if that ‘god’ were the FSM or a ‘teapot circling Mars’? Requiring only a belief in a ‘god’ besides openly accepting unprovable nonsense, leaves you open to the truly crazy.
So just like the extreme Muslims, if someone does not follow “your” believes they are less human and should be eliminated? I say You don’t know, nobody knows for sure. The only sure thing is those people like yourself who “Think” they know and everyone else is wrong are closed minded fools.
Nope, that is not what I said. What I said is that and organization willing to accept the the vagaries of any notion of an invisible superman, leaves it open to all sorts of crazy.
Encouraging a culture that says it’s OK to believe whatever you want just because that’s what you want to believe facilitates arbitrary thinking and action. Eventually, in fact quite rapidly, you’re going to get people who are going to turn it ugly. Consider, for example, slavery in the United States, supposedly a country founded on a principle of freedom and universal inalienable rights.
Agree very much with this. Everybody can run away with some metaphysical beliefs and make anything from it.
TTiOT, why should we make a detour via some kind of god or higher power, or whatever you want? Why is it not enough to believe that the world is a better place when we subscribe to some simple to a few principles, like freedom and universal inalienable rights. Using the idea of a higher power for this is childish, is a way to manipulate people to a certain behaviour, and once when the ‘mechanism of manipulation’ is build up, people will misuse it.
Maybe the truth in this respect is not out there, but only in us. Or how should I understand your nickname?
You must be hung up on the word God, I don’t believe in a invisible superman or a guy with a long white beard. God means different things to different people, I use the word as it is the most common English word to describe a higher power/intelligence/creator etc.. As I said before I do not believe in the bible. Koran etc etc. however if people choose to follow those ideas it is there right to do so. The biggest problem is with people who Force there believes on others and if they do not agree there next action is to attack them. Which is the same thing all extremist religions like to do, be it christian, Muslim, etc.
I question everything and follow only what I choose to follow, not what someone wants to force me to follow.
God means different things to different people, I use the word as it is the most common English word to describe a higher power/intelligence/creator etc..
Yes, it means different things depending on when and where you live. Zeus had muscles and was a male because in those times physical strength was valued very highly. Today it’s the god of higher power and intelligence. In other words, the immortal version of Bill Gates. Tell me what is the fashion of the day, I’ll tell you what your god looks like.
You must be hung up on the word God, I don’t believe in a invisible superman or a guy with a long white beard. God means different things to different people, I use the word as it is the most common English word to describe a higher power/intelligence/creator etc.. As I said before I do not believe in the bible. Koran etc etc. however if people choose to follow those ideas it is there right to do so. The biggest problem is with people who Force there believes on others and if they do not agree there next action is to attack them. Which is the same thing all extremist religions like to do, be it christian, Muslim, etc.
I question everything and follow only what I choose to follow, not what someone wants to force me to follow.
I’m glad you are willing to question what people try to force upon you. However, I’ve never thought of such a quality as valuable as the willingness to question/challenge yourself, and your current beliefs. Have you scrutinized your own “choice to follow” the particular path you’ve chosen to follow? What were your findings? How sure are you of what you believe?
Today it’s the god of higher power and intelligence. In other words, the immortal version of Bill Gates.Steven Jobs!
Tell me what is the fashion of the day, I’ll tell you what your god looks like.
I did not realize Masonry required a belief in a ‘god’. I wonder how they would feel, if that ‘god’ were the FSM or a ‘teapot circling Mars’? Requiring only a belief in a ‘god’ besides openly accepting unprovable nonsense, leaves you open to the truly crazy.
So does the VFW, and the Boy Scouts used to require a belief in a god, but I was just told that they no longer do, that they now even have a badge for “Humanism”
BTW, I am not sure this is still the case, but a friend of mine was interested in joining the Masons about thirty years ago, but he was a RC and the Church had a rule against it. Don’t know if it is still the case. I do know that many of my black friends and co-workers belonged to the organization.
[ Edited: 03 March 2011 09:32 AM by garythehuman ]
I had a great uncle who was both a mason and a Mason. My grandmother thought that was a great hoot and was bragging about it to everyone- mason by trade and Mason by religion (or whatever it’s called).
Tell me what is the fashion of the day, I’ll tell you what your god looks like.
