The Potty Peer Lord Monckton’s new and improved “Swastika Talk”
Posted: 23 June 2011 10:45 PM   [ Ignore ]
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When science won’t do, there’s always lies and fear mongering to fall back on.
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/2765990.html
moncktonhitler.jpg
courtesy of Deltoid

This is what the right wing is being reduced to, insane extremism in the name of ignoring the facts and honest scientific curiosity.

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Yes, that’s the same Monckton who became Mother Jone’s number two on their “12 loudest members of the chorus claiming that global warming is a joke and that CO2 emissions are actually good for you.”

By Josh Harkinson ~ Mother Jones
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

SkepticalScience sets the record straight:
http://www.skepticalscience.com/Monckton_Myths.htm
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

Heck I’ve got my own dozen Open Letters To Lord Monckton, though in honesty after the third letter the good Lord no longer found any time for me.
August & September 2010
http://citizenschallenge.blogspot.com/

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Posted: 24 June 2011 05:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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citizenschallenge.pm - 23 June 2011 10:45 PM

This is what the right wing is being reduced to, insane extremism in the name of ignoring the facts and honest scientific curiosity.

I’m no fan of neo-nazi’s, and I’ll admit that they’re more likely to be on the right than the left, but to generalize to everyone on the right is just needlessly inflammatory.  Oh, and completely, objectively wrong.

I’ve only been in these forums for about 2 weeks now, but the number of threads here that end up being about left and right when they should be about science and ethics is somewhat disheartening.  CFI’s supposed to be, at least in part, about skepticism—how can you be skeptical through a veil of party allegiance?

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Posted: 24 June 2011 05:55 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Erik Davis - 24 June 2011 05:52 AM
citizenschallenge.pm - 23 June 2011 10:45 PM

This is what the right wing is being reduced to, insane extremism in the name of ignoring the facts and honest scientific curiosity.

I’m no fan of neo-nazi’s, and I’ll admit that they’re more likely to be on the right than the left, but to generalize to everyone on the right is just needlessly inflammatory.  Oh, and completely, objectively wrong.

I’ve only been in these forums for about 2 weeks now, but the number of threads here that end up being about left and right when they should be about science and ethics is somewhat disheartening.  CFI’s supposed to be, at least in part, about skepticism—how can you be skeptical through a veil of party allegiance?

excaim

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Posted: 24 June 2011 07:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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Oh now you got me feeling all guilty,  red face  though in my defense I did put this under “Pseudoscience.”

And sadly what you complained is what we are dealing these days… the Republican aren’t even interested in real science any more.  It’s all about political points and not rocking the corporate profit machine. {but now we shouldn’t talk about that either?}

I myself would love to talk a bit more about science details, specially the incoming information regarding global warming and other Earth sciences and agree that there should be more of that… but there doesn’t seem too much interest.  Or maybe it’s simply become such a disheartening subject it’s easier to zone out and ignore it.



But, here just to show I’m capable of the high road of science for the love of it  
cheese

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Posted: 24 June 2011 11:11 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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Erik, You know I been chewing on your comment and I’m left with wondering how do we deal with the strategized attack that science is being subjected to?  Specially since so much of it can be track back to ideology driven folks of a certain stripe?

Sceptic Lord under fire, but speech to go ahead
Tom Arup
June 24, 2011

In his article, Lord Monckton said the cost of carbon reduction schemes ‘‘exceeds that of the imagined [and largely imaginary] damage from unmitigated warming’‘. ‘‘The Planet was triumphantly Saved 2000 years ago by a carpenter’s son from Galilee. It does not need Saving again,’’ he writes.

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Posted: 24 June 2011 11:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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Erik Davis - 24 June 2011 05:52 AM
citizenschallenge.pm - 23 June 2011 10:45 PM

This is what the right wing is being reduced to, insane extremism in the name of ignoring the facts and honest scientific curiosity.

I’m no fan of neo-nazi’s, and I’ll admit that they’re more likely to be on the right than the left, but to generalize to everyone on the right is just needlessly inflammatory.  Oh, and completely, objectively wrong.

I’ve only been in these forums for about 2 weeks now, but the number of threads here that end up being about left and right when they should be about science and ethics is somewhat disheartening.  CFI’s supposed to be, at least in part, about skepticism—how can you be skeptical through a veil of party allegiance?

you know, I’ve been thinking about your comment on and off all day.

On the groovy hippy dippy side I totally agree with your basic complaint about labeling and needless inflammatory insinuations…
on the other hand from a real-politik stand point it doesn’t hold near the weight.

In particular, starting with Dr. Seitz (et al.) and the Marshall institute there has been a strategic attack on science any time it get’s in the way of certain corporate interests, yes go ahead read ‘the military industrial complex’ into that… after that add right-wing interests.  Coupled with that, we had the cynical Rove Plan, that masterfully wed Evangelical passions with right-wing political passions.

I would love as much as anyone to get away from such labels because I know many right wing folks who on a personal work-a-day level are great humans and friends, yet when I hear their political convictions and their litany of blatantly false political propaganda it’s hideous, and ignorant beyond comprehension. 

Erik, got any suggestions?

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Posted: 26 June 2011 01:00 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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citizenschallenge.pm - 24 June 2011 07:48 AM

Oh now you got me feeling all guilty,  red face  though in my defense I did put this under “Pseudoscience.”

And sadly what you complained is what we are dealing these days… the Republican aren’t even interested in real science any more.  It’s all about political points and not rocking the corporate profit machine. {but now we shouldn’t talk about that either?}

I myself would love to talk a bit more about science details, specially the incoming information regarding global warming and other Earth sciences and agree that there should be more of that… but there doesn’t seem too much interest.  Or maybe it’s simply become such a disheartening subject it’s easier to zone out and ignore it.



But, here just to show I’m capable of the high road of science for the love of it  
cheese

CC,

I follow every word and link that you provide in this forum in your quest to raise awareness of human impact on the earth’s climate. 

On occasion we all use words of convenience, but as PLaclair reminds us, it is the content of the message that counts.

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Posted: 26 June 2011 09:33 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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thanks for the thumbs up.
But, back to Erik’s comments, they are valid and worth talking about.

Write4U - 26 June 2011 01:00 AM

On occasion we all use words of convenience, but as PLaclair reminds us, it is the content of the message that counts.

citizenschallenge.pm - 24 June 2011 11:06 PM
Erik Davis - 24 June 2011 05:52 AM
citizenschallenge.pm - 23 June 2011 10:45 PM

This is what the right wing is being reduced to, insane extremism in the name of ignoring the facts and honest scientific curiosity.

I’m no fan of neo-nazi’s, and I’ll admit that they’re more likely to be on the right than the left, but to generalize to everyone on the right is just needlessly inflammatory.  Oh, and completely, objectively wrong.

I’ve only been in these forums for about 2 weeks now, but the number of threads here that end up being about left and right when they should be about science and ethics is somewhat disheartening.  CFI’s supposed to be, at least in part, about skepticism—how can you be skeptical through a veil of party allegiance?

you know, I’ve been thinking about your comment on and off all day.

On the groovy hippy dippy side I totally agree with your basic complaint about labeling and needless inflammatory insinuations…
on the other hand from a real-politik stand point it doesn’t hold near the weight.

In particular, starting with Dr. Seitz (et al.) and the Marshall institute there has been a strategic attack on science any time it get’s in the way of certain corporate interests, yes go ahead read ‘the military industrial complex’ into that… after that add right-wing interests.  Coupled with that, we had the cynical Rove Plan, that masterfully wed Evangelical passions with right-wing political passions.

I would love as much as anyone to get away from such labels because I know many right wing folks who on a personal work-a-day level are great humans and friends, yet when I hear their political convictions and their litany of blatantly false political propaganda it’s hideous, and ignorant beyond comprehension. 

anyone, got any suggestions, thoughts?

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Posted: 26 June 2011 04:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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OK, I took Erik’s comments to mean that some people take any topic - say shoelaces - and turn it into a left or right characteristic. I did not take him to mean that there are not times when left/right is legitimate. For example, can you believe the clowns who are in the ring for the Republican presidential nomination.

What’s not OK is to take a conversation about a general topic like pollution, racism, corporate favoritism, or climate change and then talk about how the left or the right feel about them. It just isn’t true that everyone on one side shares the same opinion. And by adding a right/left factor to a discussion, the discussion is diluted by meaningless but emotional input.

If that’s not what you meant, Eric please slap me…  tongue wink

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Posted: 30 June 2011 10:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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Erik Davis - 24 June 2011 05:52 AM

I’ve only been in these forums for about 2 weeks now, but the number of threads here that end up being about left and right when they should be about science and ethics is somewhat disheartening.  CFI’s supposed to be, at least in part, about skepticism—how can you be skeptical through a veil of party allegiance?

Amusing and sadly ironic, isn’t it?

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Posted: 05 July 2011 06:38 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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Erik Davis - 24 June 2011 05:52 AM
citizenschallenge.pm - 23 June 2011 10:45 PM

This is what the right wing is being reduced to, insane extremism in the name of ignoring the facts and honest scientific curiosity.

I’m no fan of neo-nazi’s, and I’ll admit that they’re more likely to be on the right than the left, but to generalize to everyone on the right is just needlessly inflammatory.  Oh, and completely, objectively wrong.

Umm, I think you might have missed something.  It is the anti-environmentalists that are calling the environmentalists Nazis.  So, if you support measures to stop global warming, or measures to reduce pollutants in the air and water, then Lord Monckton is calling you a Nazi.

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Posted: 05 July 2011 09:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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Tradition Of Progress - 05 July 2011 06:38 PM
Erik Davis - 24 June 2011 05:52 AM
citizenschallenge.pm - 23 June 2011 10:45 PM

This is what the right wing is being reduced to, insane extremism in the name of ignoring the facts and honest scientific curiosity.

I’m no fan of neo-nazi’s, and I’ll admit that they’re more likely to be on the right than the left, but to generalize to everyone on the right is just needlessly inflammatory.  Oh, and completely, objectively wrong.

Umm, I think you might have missed something.  It is the anti-environmentalists that are calling the environmentalists Nazis.  So, if you support measures to stop global warming, or measures to reduce pollutants in the air and water, then Lord Monckton is calling you a Nazi.

Wow, great point… and I was all about feeling guilty about my own biases and missed that.

Erik, I’m sad we lost you on this conversation.

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Posted: 09 July 2011 02:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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citizenschallenge.pm - 05 July 2011 09:18 PM
Tradition Of Progress - 05 July 2011 06:38 PM
Erik Davis - 24 June 2011 05:52 AM
citizenschallenge.pm - 23 June 2011 10:45 PM

This is what the right wing is being reduced to, insane extremism in the name of ignoring the facts and honest scientific curiosity.

I’m no fan of neo-nazi’s, and I’ll admit that they’re more likely to be on the right than the left, but to generalize to everyone on the right is just needlessly inflammatory.  Oh, and completely, objectively wrong.

Umm, I think you might have missed something.  It is the anti-environmentalists that are calling the environmentalists Nazis.  So, if you support measures to stop global warming, or measures to reduce pollutants in the air and water, then Lord Monckton is calling you a Nazi.

Wow, great point… and I was all about feeling guilty about my own biases and missed that.

Erik, I’m sad we lost you on this conversation.

I don’t think you should feel too guilty.  Those who ridicule environmentalists frequently, or just about always refer to environmentalists as “left wing”.  When the movie Happy Feet had a reference to global warming, it was either Sean Hannity or Bill O’Reilly or both who called the movie “Left wing propaganda”.  I do not think there are any anti-environmentalists who do not consider environmentalism to be “left wing”.  Also, using the terms “left wing” and “right wing” do not reveal a “veil of party allegiance”.  I am under the impression that many of us Secular Humanists are disappointed with all 3 political parties.

The Republicans lately have been promising “Fiscal responsibility” but as soon as they have enough seats in either the House or Senate, they instead introduce bills to support compulsory pregnancy and to have “In God We Trust” and “One Nation Under God” posted on all government buildings.

The Democrats give us the impression that they will save us from the theocratic and anti-scientific nonsense of the Republicans, but as soon as they held a majority in Congress, they approved spending for that ineffective theologically-based “abstinence only” sex education.  Also, in the Illinois legislature, which is mostly Democrats, many Democrats support the law requiring a few minutes at the beginning of every school day for prayer or “silent reflection” in all Illinois public schools.  It was my state senator, Kimberly Lightford who sponsors that.  (So, I am somewhat at fault for not finding out that she was running completley unopposed until too late and therefore for failing to get my name on a ballot as ay least a protest candidate).

The Green party seems to promise and support what best coincides with our Secular Humanist affirmations
but when they get elected to House and Senate seats…umm, err, ahem, whenever they get elected… yeah, well that’s the problem.  And then there are also stealth Republicans that get put into the Green party in order to weaken the opposition to Republican candidates.

Anyway, this thread has become way off topic.  I think the only thing you should feel guilty about is introducing a topic that does not provide some pseudo-scientific claim that we can all enjoy poking fun at.

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Posted: 09 July 2011 09:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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Tradition Of Progress - 09 July 2011 02:56 PM

  I am under the impression that many of us Secular Humanists are disappointed with all 3 political parties.

AY to that.

Tradition Of Progress - 09 July 2011 02:56 PM

Anyway, this thread has become way off topic.  I think the only thing you should feel guilty about is introducing a topic that does not provide some pseudo-scientific claim that we can all enjoy poking fun at.

cheese

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