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Is ufology now a religion?
Posted: 12 October 2011 04:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 31 ]
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No, not those ones, Asanta. Just the Nazca Lines…for now.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 06:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 32 ]
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I am not a scientist by any means and I have learned that many of the books I have read are considered trash here.  I will refrain from sharing my opinions where I am not qualified to present.  I will continue to read and learn.  I just received Michael Shermer’s new book and I dare mention his name here.  He was someone I met at a convention and I was stunned by his presentation based on his skepticism.  He too has slapped me down for believing in certain scientific opinions.  After 911, a dozen books came out on our vulnerability and lack of preparedness and all seemed to point at the Bush Administration for being way too lax in programs like our Air Traffic control rules.  There was even a theory that V.P. Cheney had schedule some air trials on that morning which is why the Defense Jets were not aware of the situation.  I stopped reading and began to research why our government was under attack by the religious right which to me was far more dangerous than the Taliban.

I was thrown out several sites for bringing this up.  I was able to get a DVD which had been shown on the History Channel but banned from American television.  It told a remarkable story that started during the Korean war.  It told the story of how Osama Bin Ladin became the leader of the Al Qaeda movement in the middle east.  All of this was kept out of news and I felt someone should read this stuff.  If it is bullshit then sobeit.  I had always believed that the battle against Communism in America was a lie to simply promote the Christian movement and was promoted by the Christians using the popular terrorism concept of scaring the crap out of Americans. 

I have not and will not bring my opinions of this here.  By the time the American people finally wake up to this self inflicted terrorism I will be long dead and won’t care. 

I regret not checking the spelling of Hawking’s name but the arthritis in my hands is getting worse.  Typing can be painful.  I will be more careful in the future.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 03:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 33 ]
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George - 12 October 2011 04:57 AM

No, not those ones, Asanta. Just the Nazca Lines…for now.

Why not the others? Do you have an explanation for those?

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Posted: 12 October 2011 04:44 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 34 ]
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Whenever the subject of aliens visiting Earth comes up, someone is certain to say something to the effect that “Other habitable planets are just too far away. It would take far too long for any aliens to come here.” Which squelches all further discussion.

It seems to me that this particular squelch contains at least two unspoken assumptions.

1) That any hypothetical aliens have a level of technology comparable to, or just slightly in advance of, our own. But if they’ve been at this space travel business for a few millennia longer than we have, maybe they’ve figured out some kind of propulsion system that we can’t yet imagine; any more than the captain of an 18th century coal brig could have imagined a Boeing 747. Jetting reaction mass out of the rear end of your spacecraft might sound desperately primitive to an alien intelligence.

2) That they have a lifespan similar to ours. A 50-year or 100-year round trip to a nearby star and back might be a bit much for us humans with our pathetically short lives, but for an alien being who expects to live for 1000 or 2000 of our “years” - no more unthinkable than some of our historical voyages of exploration, lasting four or five years - at a time when human life expectancy was maybe 40-50 years, discounting scurvy, falling out of the rigging or encounters with cannibals.

Just my two cents’worth.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 05:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 35 ]
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Theflyingsorcerer - 12 October 2011 04:44 PM

Whenever the subject of aliens visiting Earth comes up, someone is certain to say something to the effect that “Other habitable planets are just too far away. It would take far too long for any aliens to come here.” Which squelches all further discussion.

It seems to me that this particular squelch contains at least two unspoken assumptions.

1) That any hypothetical aliens have a level of technology comparable to, or just slightly in advance of, our own. But if they’ve been at this space travel business for a few millennia longer than we have, maybe they’ve figured out some kind of propulsion system that we can’t yet imagine; any more than the captain of an 18th century coal brig could have imagined a Boeing 747. Jetting reaction mass out of the rear end of your spacecraft might sound desperately primitive to an alien intelligence.

No, the unspoken assumption is Einstein was right: FTL travel is not possible and accelerating a large mass to even .1C requires tremendous energy. People who argue that interstellar travel is possible are working under the unspoken assumption that future advances in physics will not merely add to our knowledge, but will dismantle what we know and replace it with something more conducive to interstellar travel.

2) That they have a lifespan similar to ours. A 50-year or 100-year round trip to a nearby star and back might be a bit much for us humans with our pathetically short lives, but for an alien being who expects to live for 1000 or 2000 of our “years” - no more unthinkable than some of our historical voyages of exploration, lasting four or five years - at a time when human life expectancy was maybe 40-50 years, discounting scurvy, falling out of the rigging or encounters with cannibals.

Just my two cents’worth.

See point 1.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 05:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 36 ]
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asanta - 12 October 2011 03:45 PM
George - 12 October 2011 04:57 AM

No, not those ones, Asanta. Just the Nazca Lines…for now.

Why not the others? Do you have an explanation for those?

All I am saying is that the alien explanation sounds more plausible to me than the dozen of other explanations our there. Who knows, maybe one day somebody will come up with something that makes more sense.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 05:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 37 ]
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I agree with Darron.  In addition, evolution sort of requires a fast turnover of members of a species.  The longer lives the individuals have, the slower the species will evolve.  As such, it’s doubtlful that such a long lived species (100 - 2000 years) would have had a chance to develop mental capabilities even equivalent to ours.

Occam

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Posted: 12 October 2011 05:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 38 ]
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George - 12 October 2011 05:36 PM
asanta - 12 October 2011 03:45 PM
George - 12 October 2011 04:57 AM

No, not those ones, Asanta. Just the Nazca Lines…for now.

Why not the others? Do you have an explanation for those?

All I am saying is that the alien explanation sounds more plausible to me than the dozen of other explanations our there. Who knows, maybe one day somebody will come up with something that makes more sense.

Occam’s razor works well for me! and why does it matter so much ‘why’ they made it? It was certainly within their capabilities.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 05:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 39 ]
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Occam. - 12 October 2011 05:39 PM

I agree with Darron.  In addition, evolution sort of requires a fast turnover of members of a species.  The longer lives the individuals have, the slower the species will evolve.  As such, it’s doubtlful that such a long lived species (100 - 2000 years) would have had a chance to develop mental capabilities even equivalent to ours.

Occam

Sorry, Occam, but I don’t see how that makes sense. We are much smarter than the bacteria and our life span is much greater than theirs. Or take the chimps. Their life expectancy is higher than that of the people of Swaziland.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 06:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 40 ]
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asanta - 12 October 2011 05:56 PM

Occam’s razor works well for me! and why does it matter so much ‘why’ they made it? It was certainly within their capabilities.

I don’t think the fact that it was within their capabilities has anything to do with why they would make it. The fish, spiders, monkeys, etc., make sense, but not the tens-of-miles long and miles wide zigzag lines.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 06:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 41 ]
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George - 12 October 2011 06:03 PM
asanta - 12 October 2011 05:56 PM

Occam’s razor works well for me! and why does it matter so much ‘why’ they made it? It was certainly within their capabilities.

I don’t think the fact that it was within their capabilities has anything to do with why they would make it. The fish, spiders, monkeys, etc., make sense, but not the tens-of-miles long and miles wide zigzag lines.

But humans have been doing things that made absolutely no sense to outsiders for thousands of years!

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Posted: 12 October 2011 06:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 42 ]
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asanta - 12 October 2011 06:06 PM
George - 12 October 2011 06:03 PM
asanta - 12 October 2011 05:56 PM

Occam’s razor works well for me! and why does it matter so much ‘why’ they made it? It was certainly within their capabilities.

I don’t think the fact that it was within their capabilities has anything to do with why they would make it. The fish, spiders, monkeys, etc., make sense, but not the tens-of-miles long and miles wide zigzag lines.

But humans have been doing things that made absolutely no sense to outsiders for thousands of years!

On the scale of Nazca? I am not aware of any.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 06:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 43 ]
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George - 12 October 2011 06:03 PM

I don’t think the fact that it was within their capabilities has anything to do with why they would make it. The fish, spiders, monkeys, etc., make sense, but not the tens-of-miles long and miles wide zigzag lines.

Yet you think it makes sense that advanced aliens traveled trillions of miles to make those lines without leaving any other physical evidence behind. oh oh

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Posted: 12 October 2011 06:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 44 ]
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George - 12 October 2011 05:36 PM

All I am saying is that the alien explanation sounds more plausible to me than the dozen of other explanations our there. Who knows, maybe one day somebody will come up with something that makes more sense.

So it’s not plausible that humans created the lines for ritual purposes, but it is (more) plausible that spacemen came from other star systems to Nazca in order to create them for ... ritual purposes? Or what?

Sorry, but this is laughable.

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Posted: 12 October 2011 06:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 45 ]
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DarronS - 12 October 2011 06:09 PM
George - 12 October 2011 06:03 PM

I don’t think the fact that it was within their capabilities has anything to do with why they would make it. The fish, spiders, monkeys, etc., make sense, but not the tens-of-miles long and miles wide zigzag lines.

Yet you think it makes sense that advanced aliens traveled trillions of miles to make those lines without leaving any other physical evidence behind. oh oh

Again, it makes more sense than the other explanations.

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