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Homosexuality
Posted: 14 January 2012 11:27 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 46 ]
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George - 14 January 2012 10:32 AM

In a theory, homosexuality could be a byproduct of some other adaptation. If natural selection selected against that particular trait, homosexuality could disappear. In a theory.

Good point, in theory.

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Posted: 14 January 2012 02:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 47 ]
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That was exacltly my point. If the genes that are associated w/ homosexuality are also associated with other caracterisics, the genes can be selected for strongly enough on the basis of this characteristic to ouweigh any selective disadvantage to the reduced lilihood of hoosexuals having children. I suspect that is in fact the case simply because homosexuality is present in all cultures at relative low but consistent rates.

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Posted: 14 January 2012 08:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 48 ]
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traveler - 14 January 2012 09:26 AM

Strictly speaking, the hetero “coupling” you mention could involve a homosexual partner.

....which is why I wrote ‘hetero coupling’, although this could also be artificial insemination.

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Posted: 14 January 2012 08:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 49 ]
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traveler - 14 January 2012 09:26 AM
asanta - 14 January 2012 04:16 AM
traveler - 13 January 2012 01:24 PM

Yes, and it also ignores the fact that the first homosexual came from a hetero couple.

...ahem…and all subsequent homosexuals came from hetero couples, or at least a hetero coupling since parthenogenesis is not yet possible for our species!

Strictly speaking, the hetero “coupling” you mention could involve a homosexual partner. The first homosexual did however come from a true heterosexual couple. So the premise stating that if homosexuals stop having babies (through hetero coupling) then there will be no more homosexuals is clearly false.

I am questioning even the assumption that the first homosexual came from a true heterosexual couple. As far as I know homosexuality has been around since the beginning of male and female species. Homosexual behavior can be observed everywhere. The drive for sex is the hard wired component in the brain and the male drive for sex is so powerful that a young male will practise with any available partner. And if no partner is available he will have sex with himself, i.e. masturbation.
With females it may be more an emotionally based expression, but young girls undoubtedly do experiment with any available partner or in the absence, with themselves. I’m sure some of our female members can shed light on that.

[ Edited: 14 January 2012 08:51 PM by Write4U ]
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Posted: 15 January 2012 06:55 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 50 ]
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Well, W4U I’m talking about the biological Adam & Eve. Homosexuality was not an option. But I will grant you that Adam (or Eve) might have been “wishing” for another Adam (or Eve).

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Posted: 15 January 2012 07:12 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 51 ]
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traveler - 15 January 2012 06:55 AM

Well, W4U I’m talking about the biological Adam & Eve. Homosexuality was not an option. But I will grant you that Adam (or Eve) might have been “wishing” for another Adam (or Eve).

Who knows, maybe Lilith had an affair with Eve, and was banished in punishment.

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Posted: 15 January 2012 11:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 52 ]
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It’s my belief that there is no genetic drive toward procreation* or even much toward attraction.  Rather, there is a strong genetic drive toward copulation.  I don’t think homosexuality is at all linked to genetics, but to the pre- and early post birth environment.  differing hormonal levels to which the fetus is exposed probably have the greatest effect on the sexuality of the person. 

*Certainly no mammal, insect or even plant has any idea of reproducing its species.  It only has the drive to produce genetic containing cells and distribute them.  In mammals that distribution drive is usually expressed by orgasm, just often expressed as copulation.

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[ Edited: 15 January 2012 11:18 AM by Occam. ]
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Posted: 19 January 2012 11:04 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 53 ]
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alvin9247 - 19 January 2012 10:49 PM

I knew it some days ago through online internet. thanks for sharing your this topic but I actually don’t like this.

If you don’t like this topic, why are you advertising? ......You’re nothing but a spammer.

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Posted: 21 January 2012 02:09 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 54 ]
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So many great answers on this post. I took Philosophy in college, and I remember my teacher spoke on this subject, and one of the things we discussed was “is homosexuality natural”  he went on to clarify the different possible meanings of “natural” and most of my classmates came to agree that on a biological level - because male/female intercourse is the means by which we procreate - anything besides a woman and a man having intercourse to conceive a child seems “unnatural”

he then went on to say that, by this same definition, straight couples engaging in oral sex, or using contraception would be classified as “unnatural” too.

I’ve never felt any personal issues with homosexuality, or saw it as a threat, and have advocated tolerance to my friends and family. The discussions I had in Philosophy were probably some of the most deeply influential I’ve ever had - I gained a lot of perspective, and learned how to see discussions from other sides to get a better, fuller understanding of all issues surrounding the many questions.

And perhaps, one of my favorite quotes on this matter

If you don’t like gay marrige -blame straight people. They’re the ones who keep having gay babies

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Posted: 21 January 2012 03:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 55 ]
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missmac - 21 January 2012 02:09 AM

And perhaps, one of my favorite quotes on this matter

If you don’t like gay marrige -blame straight people. They’re the ones who keep having gay babies

`
*smiling*

that kinda reminds me of these great bumper stickers :)

`
tumblr_luha54UtsX1qlz1meo1_500.jpg
`

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Posted: 21 January 2012 04:07 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 56 ]
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My position is simple: you fall in love with a person. If empirically it turns out that most of these persons are of opposite sex you are heterosexual, if most are of the same sex you are homosexual, if it is about the same you are bisexual. What you are is based on your experience, it is not a choice. But there is a choice in another respect: to keep your feelings hidden, and do not live according to it, or not. I know of homosexuals who to their own surprise fall in love with a person with the other sex. In an environment where homosexuals are discriminated, it might be the ‘easy way out’. The opposite of course also happens, which might cause great doubt: are you a homosexual after all? But if one accepts this as normal, just as a partner might fall in love with just somebody of the other sex, then the problem is just the same, and the choice is yours: continue your present relationship or not.

I have a small pet theory about homo- and hetero-sexuality in general. I’ve always wondered how the brain structures of animals are in sync with the ‘outside evolution’. If mutations are random, how is it possible that the brain of an animal is always structured in such a way that it feels attracted to animals of the same species, and mostly also of the other sex? My suggestion is that it is not totally hardwired in the brain, but that it is partially learned. It is a flexible system, but as it is with flexible systems, the outcomes might differ. Just a little bit of hormone more or less, just a few experiences in your young years, decide if you become homo- or heterosexual. And that’s all fine.

[ Edited: 21 January 2012 04:46 AM by GdB ]
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Posted: 21 January 2012 08:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 57 ]
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That’s a great theory, GdB. And a very popular one among those on the left. Each side has its own amendment to the theory of evolution. Those on the right have ID and the left has its “flexible brain.”

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Posted: 21 January 2012 10:59 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 58 ]
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George - 21 January 2012 08:21 AM

That’s a great theory, GdB. And a very popular one among those on the left. Each side has its own amendment to the theory of evolution. Those on the right have ID and the left has its “flexible brain.”

Don’t you have an evolutionary explanation for that?  cool mad

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Posted: 21 January 2012 11:55 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 59 ]
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Evolutionary explanation for what? For homosexuality? FWIW, in my opinion (based on what I read), homosexuality could very well be caused by a pathogen. Just like cervical cancer or peptic ulcer.

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Posted: 21 January 2012 03:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 60 ]
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George - 21 January 2012 11:55 AM

Evolutionary explanation for what? For homosexuality? FWIW, in my opinion (based on what I read), homosexuality could very well be caused by a pathogen. Just like cervical cancer or peptic ulcer.

`
Or like something that’s not detrimental, like…....left-handedness :)

(I’ve read a few places that the percentages associated with homosexuality are almost the same as for left-handedness)

`

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