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Rebuttal to Skepchick’s youtube Homeophobia rant
Posted: 19 November 2011 08:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 61 ]
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suede - 19 November 2011 05:28 PM

You’re going to take a stand against Skepchick’s misinformation?

No, against your nonsense. We’ve wasted too much time with you. Youre not looking for an intelligent debate or discussion. Have a nice life.

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Posted: 20 November 2011 01:19 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 62 ]
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suede - 19 November 2011 05:28 PM

You’re going to take a stand against Skepchick’s misinformation?

No, Skepchick’s presentation is a skeptics cautionary tale against the misinformation spread BY homeopaths and the dangers of relying on homeopathy as an effective cure for anything.

OTOH your presentation is not a rebuttal, but is in fact a RANT, without any evidence that disproves anything she said.

If you want to be a skeptic, learn how to make rebuttals. Question after question, ad nauseum, is not a rebuttal. It is just annoying to people who have given you every opportunity to present a case disproving any of her statements.

And remember if water has memory then fecal matter must be falling on our heads when it rains…..... cheese .

Be well suede and please avoid homeopathic remedies, they don’t work.

http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=3775

[ Edited: 20 November 2011 04:31 AM by Write4U ]
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Posted: 20 November 2011 01:22 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 63 ]
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I used to believe in homeopathy and probably would have been quite like Suede if challenged on the belief. The reason was it obviously worked because we had cases of it working.

Of course I now know this is simply confusing correlation with causation, which is at the bottom of all these types of things.

My neice had a problem with her hearing and my sister had the choice between homeopathy and having a gromit fitted. My sister chose homeopathy. She’d asked my opinion and I’d said I thought it was best.

Is my neice worse of now because we effectively did nothing? I don’t know. I don’t like to ask as what is done is done and luckily I’m glad to say, her hearing seems ok.

But even if this is a case in which effectively doing nothing was harmless, that is only because we were lucky. I’m sure there are many cases in which it has done harm as this is just one of many.

I think a little comedy might be in order, this video has appeared before on the forums but is a cracker and worth posting again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMGIbOGu8q0

Stephen

[ Edited: 20 November 2011 01:46 AM by StephenLawrence ]
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Posted: 20 November 2011 01:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 64 ]
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LOL  LOL  cheese  LOL  LOL

precious

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Posted: 20 November 2011 04:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 65 ]
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I won’t mention the website, but it lists the diseases which ostensibly can be cured with homeopathy.

I have emphasized the diseases which I believe are particularly nasty when left medically untreated (correct me if I am wrong).

Within the pages of this web site are never released Natural Cures for:

Arthritis • Stress • Gas and Bloating • Back Pain • Asthma  • Anxiety • Bruising • Snoring • Heart disease • Impotence • Constipation • PMS • Fibromialgia• Insomnia • Genital Herpes  • Heartburn • Migraines • Depression • Acid reflux • Eczema  • Prostate Cancer Breast Cancer • Cold Sores • Motion Sickness • ADD • Diabetes High Blood Pressure • Fatigue • Headaches • Joint Pain • Chronic Pain • Dandruff • Lupus  • Low Sex Drive • Erectile Dysfunction • High Cholesterol • Menopause • Hair Loss • Multiple Sclerosis Plus many, many more!!

The not emphasized conditions may also be symptomatic of more serious underlying diseases.

Should we trust this website???

Way to go Skepchick….. grin

[ Edited: 20 November 2011 05:20 AM by Write4U ]
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Posted: 20 November 2011 07:50 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 66 ]
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Great vid ,Stephen. I hadn’t seen it before. They should have thrown a bit of subluxation in there.  LOL

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Posted: 20 November 2011 08:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 67 ]
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StephenLawrence - 20 November 2011 01:22 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMGIbOGu8q0

Stephen

Hillarious. Especially the homeopathic Lager

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Posted: 20 November 2011 12:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 68 ]
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Sorry, Suede.  I should not have called you a moron.  While I believe your statements have no basis in fact and your lack of evidential responses to arguments against them an indication of trolling, I should have given you the benefit of the doubt.

Occam

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Posted: 20 November 2011 04:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 69 ]
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What am I supposed to rebut from Prof. Grump’s homeophobia video rant, Cap’t Jill?  Funny all the insults this senior citizen makes of a industry that is highly successful.


Oh and thanks for the video.  It revealed the real reason you skeptics are irked by Homeopathy; not because you’re mostly concerned about people being harmed or ripped off by it, but because Homeopathy is an affront to science

And your rebuttal is purile name calling? My god man, you even provoked Occam into it! 1. Have you ever read any of James Randi’s books? Have you studied his results on homeopathic medicine? Name calling is schoolyard behavior and colors your arguments as mindless ranting. 2. Just because something has been around for a century or two dosen’t make it the same or more effective than modern medicine. 18th Century medicinal practices can’t stand up to 21st Century medicine ex. syphallis cures using blue mass (mercury pills) as opposed to a shot of penicillan. 3. Despite the AMPLE evidence presented to you about the ineffectiveness of homeopathy you adamantly refuse to concede your opinion based on skeptchick’s argument. You seem more intent on proving her wrong than anyone else here. And 4, yes millions of people can be wrong about something, no matter what it is, be it religion or medicinal practices. And they don’t have to be illiterate either. I have a good friend who won’t take a flu shot because he doesn’t trust what’s being put into it. As a poster here I’d appreciate it if you would tone down the name calling and tone up the evidence to support your claims. BTW that’s a challenge.


Cap’t Jack

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Posted: 20 November 2011 05:49 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 70 ]
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Occam. - 20 November 2011 12:57 PM

Sorry, Suede.  I should not have called you a moron.  While I believe your statements have no basis in fact and your lack of evidential responses to arguments against them an indication of trolling, I should have given you the benefit of the doubt.

Occam

I don’t think suede is a moron at all (judging by the way he writes and expresses himself). But that’s what is so puzzling about people like suede: Why do intelligent people believe in nonsense? I call it the “Francis Collins syndrome.”  smile

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Posted: 20 November 2011 05:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 71 ]
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They believe it because it comforts them. My question is: Why do otherwise intelligent people find comfort in nonsense?

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Posted: 20 November 2011 06:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 72 ]
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suede - 19 November 2011 04:46 PM
ShadowSot - 18 November 2011 10:05 PM

Oh yeah, and while bloodletting is good if you have that specific blood disorder, it’s useless for anything else, whereas historically it was used to treat a multitude of symptons.

Is that bloodletting’s fault?

I disagree Mid Atlantic. there are some heral treatments that are helpful, yes, however at the same time there are a number of treatments sold at sotres as herbs that do not.

Is that the Herb’s fault?

Your responses to considered opinions is the crux (and the problem) of this discussion.

NO ONE is faulting bloodletting, bloodletting itself is not a practitioner but a practice. I am faulting (and excusing) the medieval practitioners of bloodletting as being uninformed. But for a practitioner to persist in proven ineffective or harmful practices, in spite of modern scientific evidence, makes the practitioner a quack at best and a scammer at worst.

NO ONE is faulting herbs, herbs are naturally occurring plants, some with beneficial properties, which were used by serious medicine (wo)men in days of old as the only available medicines at that time. As has been previously mentioned, there is no disagreement about some herbs having beneficial properties. But a claim that herbs are “more” effective than modern medicine derived from these herbs or synthesized is false and a scam.

NO ONE is disputing the concept of “like cures like” to build immunity for a select few diseases which can be prevented by introducing the body to small amounts of that microbe. It is called “vaccination”, but modern vaccines use “dead” microbes in order to stimulate the production of antibodies which “recognize” the shape of the microorganism and thereby can respond faster to infection. Anyone who professes that diseases caused by micro-organisms are disturbances of the “vital life force” are quacks or scammers.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_purpose_of_vaccines

What is the purpose of vaccinating a person with live microorganisms, when the body is already infected with live organisms and is already producing anti-bodies?  When the organism is too virulent for the body to combat and control the infection by itself you do not aggravate the situation by adding “dilutions” of more live organisms, you assist the body with anti-biotics (penicillin, vibramycin, etc) to combat the virulent organism itself.

Maybe, just maybe, in a few select cases homeopathic “like cures like” may be effective as a preventive immunizaton method, but it does not CURE anything. Purposely infecting someone with live organisms (at any dilution) without strict medical controls and supervision is potentially life threatening.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy

suede, you are obviously a bright person with analytical ability. But in order to come to a skeptically considered conclusion, you’ll have to do research, not only on the “unsubstantiated” claims of the benefits of homeopathy, but also on the “substantiated” claims of medical experts that homeopathy is at best ineffective and at worst dangerous.

It is obvious you do not have this expertise and your attack on Skepchick’s narrative (who undoubtedly has researched the subject) is just not valid.

[ Edited: 20 November 2011 10:34 PM by Write4U ]
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Posted: 20 November 2011 06:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 73 ]
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DarronS - 20 November 2011 05:56 PM

They believe it because it comforts them. My question is: Why do otherwise intelligent people find comfort in nonsense?

Well, I once had a VW (a fine German automobile) and one day its back window exploded for no apparent reason. S..t happens, I guess.  cheese

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Posted: 21 November 2011 11:59 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 74 ]
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suede - 18 November 2011 08:06 PM
domokato - 18 November 2011 07:16 PM
suede - 18 November 2011 07:07 PM

Maybe you’ll confront Skepchick about her errors and flawed logic?

Yes, maybe. But probably not, because I agree with her conclusion. I’d rather spend my time confronting people I disagree with.

You don’t think it’s hypocritical to protest the other side you say are spreading misinformation, but OK for your side to?

Faulty or incomplete logic is not tantamount to “misinformation”

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Posted: 21 November 2011 12:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 75 ]
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suede - 19 November 2011 05:28 PM

And perhaps you could explain in biological terms exactly how homeopathically prepared ecoli is different than any other sort of e.coli?
For you to critisize her comments you have to explain what is incorrect about them.

You are missing the point (which seems to be a common theme here).  She says “according to Homeopathy” and that’s not what Homeopathy says how to treat E Coli, regardless of if the method works or not.  That’s the problem I have; her misinformation of Homeopathy.

I take it because you guys don’t believe in Homeopathy, you can spread any amount of misinformation about it?

What does it matter? Drink more fecal matter, drink more e coli - both are equally ridiculous!

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