EOC, Thanks for defending the agnostic position, despite that your non-traditional definition of a possible god, would probably qualify you as an atheist, I think.
I think that in a very literal sense, you would be correct in that I lack a belief in deity.
In the end, it’s not any deity I’m hostile to. It’s really a waste of time to be hostile to something which either doesn’t exist or which obviously doesn’t give a flying flip about us if it does. What I’m hostile to is religion, notably the organized variaty which as far as I’m concerned, is the most damaging moneymaking and power grubbing scam in history.
I went with 6. It describes me pretty well. Agnostic atheist: Don’t believe a deity exists, and operate under the assumption that none does, but can’t deny it’s a possibility that one could.
I believe that certainty is asymptotic - increasingly approachable via skeptical inquiry, but never fully reachable. That puts #7 out of bounds for me.
I also believe that the nonexistence of evidence is not the same thing as evidence of nonexistence.
Therefore, while the world is devoid of any evidence for the existence of any deities as conceived in any of the various spiritual traditions I’m aware of… AND while the mythology underlying those traditions are rife with internal contradictions and, at best, tortured logic… AND while it seems so apparent that the deities in these traditions were crafted in the image of humans (rather than the other way around) and in such as way as to be psychologically compelling and tantalizing to humanity… that still doesn’t PROVE that there is no deity. It just makes it appear terribly unlikely that there is one.
My reasoning is the same as yours, Maswah. While I don’t agree with the absolutist position, as I recall. DarronS and Daddyhominum did give fairly decent arguments for it in earlier posts. The difference seems to be whether one does or doesn’t round off a probability of ten to the minus whatever to zero. Those who do, choose 7. Those of us who don’t, choose 6.
None of these is quite right for me; they all depend on dicey interpretations. But I suppose I’d fall somewhere between 6 and 7.
(Also, I think the strongest atheist position shouldn’t be described as “100% certain”, whatever that means, but rather that the existence of God is logically impossible, i.e. the concept “God” implies a contradiction. I don’t think this is correct, but I know there are some atheists who’ve claimed to believe it).
I won’t argue with Dawhins on his wording but in reality I think more like an agnostic but going by his definitions I would rate myself as a 6.
Depends what you mean by “well.” He did explain his position, hmm, eloquently, but he’s still wrong.
Thank you, George, for showing me the error of my ways through your thorough and thoughtful critique.
My critique was directed at Tim, not you.
I am not going to ctiticize you for your beliefs. Anyone who thinks he is a 6 when it comes to God, but 7 when the existence of Santa is questioned, is making stuff up—just like the theists. But to each his own.
Depends what you mean by “well.” He did explain his position, hmm, eloquently, but he’s still wrong.
Thank you, George, for showing me the error of my ways through your thorough and thoughtful critique.
My critique was directed at Tim, not you.
I am not going to ctiticize you for your beliefs. Anyone who thinks he is a 6 when it comes to God, but 7 when the existence of Santa is questioned, is making stuff up—just like the theists. But to each his own.
I was being sarcastic. To simply declare me to be “wrong” (without having the courtesy to address the comment to me directly, by the way) without the slightest elaboration is frivolous. To then come back and say, “I’m not going to criticize you for your beliefs”, then to do precisely that with another frivolous comment, is just plain obnoxious.
As I said in my post, as a scientific skeptic, I do not believe in 100% certainty, period. Therefore, I would not choose 7 on your hypothetical santa scale either. YOU were the one who pulled that out of the air. So, who’s making stuff up now, “like the theists”?
Depends what you mean by “well.” He did explain his position, hmm, eloquently, but he’s still wrong.
Thank you, George, for showing me the error of my ways through your thorough and thoughtful critique.
My critique was directed at Tim, not you.
I am not going to ctiticize you for your beliefs. Anyone who thinks he is a 6 when it comes to God, but 7 when the existence of Santa is questioned, is making stuff up—just like the theists. But to each his own.
I stand by my praise of Maswah’s post and am undeterred by your critique.
