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Is religion good for anything?
Posted: 29 November 2012 10:24 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 61 ]
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mid atlantic - 29 November 2012 08:43 PM
TimB - 29 November 2012 06:44 PM
asanta - 29 November 2012 06:31 PM
VYAZMA - 28 November 2012 01:37 PM

Apparently religion was good for something.  I could begin to enumerate the many positive effects it had on the formation of the United States and the abolition of slavery to start.

Religion had a LOT to do with the continuation and justification of slavery.

I think that you are each correct here.  I wonder whether slavery would have existed historically even without the influence of religion, though perhaps to a greater or lesser extent?  Slavery, apparently, still exists today, though not openly, as far as I know.

Slavery is still very common worldwide - in many regions it is out in the open. Even in the US, believe or not.

There was a recent case of sexual slavery in my area -
http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-05-15/news/bs-md-co-sex-abuse-20120515_1_slave-case-indictment-abuse-charges

http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/documentaries/2009/05/090515_ antislavery

http://www.hrw.org/legacy/backgrounder/africa/sudanupdate.htmhttp

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_slavery

That gives me a sick feeling.

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Posted: 30 November 2012 12:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 62 ]
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TimB - 29 November 2012 10:24 PM
mid atlantic - 29 November 2012 08:43 PM
TimB - 29 November 2012 06:44 PM
asanta - 29 November 2012 06:31 PM
VYAZMA - 28 November 2012 01:37 PM

Apparently religion was good for something.  I could begin to enumerate the many positive effects it had on the formation of the United States and the abolition of slavery to start.

Religion had a LOT to do with the continuation and justification of slavery.

I think that you are each correct here.  I wonder whether slavery would have existed historically even without the influence of religion, though perhaps to a greater or lesser extent?  Slavery, apparently, still exists today, though not openly, as far as I know.

Slavery is still very common worldwide - in many regions it is out in the open. Even in the US, believe or not.

There was a recent case of sexual slavery in my area -
http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2012-05-15/news/bs-md-co-sex-abuse-20120515_1_slave-case-indictment-abuse-charges

http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/documentaries/2009/05/090515_ antislavery

http://www.hrw.org/legacy/backgrounder/africa/sudanupdate.htmhttp

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_slavery

That gives me a sick feeling.

  It’s effed up.

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Posted: 04 December 2012 03:30 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 63 ]
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TimB - 29 November 2012 06:44 PM
asanta - 29 November 2012 06:31 PM
VYAZMA - 28 November 2012 01:37 PM

Apparently religion was good for something.  I could begin to enumerate the many positive effects it had on the formation of the United States and the abolition of slavery to start.

Religion had a LOT to do with the continuation and justification of slavery.

I think that you are each correct here.  I wonder whether slavery would have existed historically even without the influence of religion, though perhaps to a greater or lesser extent?  Slavery, apparently, still exists today, though not openly, as far as I know.

Most definitely. See Villiage Atheist’s post.
I think your positing this question is exactly like asking:  I wonder whether draft animals would have existed without the influence of religion.

Organized religion in the US helped launch the woman’s movement. Suffrage, charities, better conditions for children, more open participation for women, etc etc..
It took several hundred pages of history to have these seemingly cliche points turned around into actual intersting historical points.

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Posted: 04 December 2012 07:22 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 64 ]
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deros - 27 September 2012 05:24 AM

There is no way we will all ever agree on that but this is an article, though short on giving reasons, says no.

http://machineslikeus.com/news/religion-good-anything-0

The only good thing about religion is that it’s a never-ending example to show the folly of following myths.

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Posted: 04 December 2012 09:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 65 ]
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Religious feelings saved my life!

No individual atheist or any organized Humanist
had time to help me save my life. A Baptist Pastor
that had gone to Therapy Institute and had license
to help people gave of his free time free of charge
for to save my life without asking me to be a Christian.

I made a contract with him that I wanted to stay atheist.
He kept that promise and weekly talks with him about Jesus
saved my life without making me a believer.

So organized religion allow individual believers to afford
to be there for anybody if them find that in line with their faith.

So religion is good for something. To save life is one such thing.

Organized religion allowed me to spend 3.5 years together
with believers and to stay atheist during that time and now
30 years later I am still atheist and Humanism or organized
atheism has nothing comparable here UpNorth Europe.
I met them several times a week Sunday Services and
Bible Study and Pray Groups and music and so on.

I got to know hundreds of believers. That did not happen
when I later joined the secular Humanists. They had not
time for a loser. They wanted a political activist for Human Rights.

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Posted: 04 December 2012 11:28 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 66 ]
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Like any other human invented tool religion can be used for good or bad purposes.

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All the Gods and all religions are created by humans, to meet human needs and accomplish human ends.

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Posted: 04 December 2012 04:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 67 ]
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garythehuman - 04 December 2012 11:28 AM

Like any other human invented tool religion can be used for good or bad purposes.

It is interesting you use the word created.
An atheist???? not sure maybe he is something else
But he got very upset when I wrote somethign very similar.
I used same word created and he asserted that humans
when they create something then it exist and God does no exist
so humans can only imagine God and not create God.

So all atheist have very different take on it. I agree with you
that humans create work of art and work of personal imagination
and create hopes and dreams and notions and do they really exist?

If I create an idea using my imagination like when I came up with
The Next Future Faith that will exist some 1000 years from now
that is a pure fantasy but it “exists” in my head as an idea.

why would that be so bad usage of words. Well he asserted that
I used the word totally wrong. So I did not dare to say it again smile

so from now on Humans imagine God into existence smile

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Posted: 04 December 2012 05:00 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 68 ]
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It took several hundred pages of history to have these seemingly cliche points turned around into actual intersting historical points


Anyone interested in pursuing this topic could start by reading Kenneth Stamp’s book “The Peculiar Institution”. It’s a classic on Southern Slavery.

 

Cap’t Jack

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One good schoolmaster is of more use than a hundred priests.

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Posted: 04 December 2012 05:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 69 ]
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Religious feelings saved my life!

No individual atheist or any organized Humanist
had time to help me save my life. A Baptist Pastor
that had gone to Therapy Institute and had license
to help people gave of his free time free of charge
for to save my life without asking me to be a Christian.

I made a contract with him that I wanted to stay atheist.
He kept that promise and weekly talks with him about Jesus
saved my life without making me a believer.

So organized religion allow individual believers to afford
to be there for anybody if them find that in line with their faith.

So religion is good for something. To save life is one such thing.

Organized religion allowed me to spend 3.5 years together
with believers and to stay atheist during that time and now
30 years later I am still atheist and Humanism or organized
atheism has nothing comparable here UpNorth Europe.
I met them several times a week Sunday Services and
Bible Study and Pray Groups and music and so on.

I got to know hundreds of believers. That did not happen
when I later joined the secular Humanists. They had not
time for a loser. They wanted a political activist for Human Rights.

In that respect religion did have a purpose in your life giving comfort and a sense of belonging. It also helps your self esteem when someone or group shows a particular interest in you ex. Praying for your benefit etc. that’s also why people join cults, because they are drawn to them when they are most vulnerable emotionally or physically in some cases. there are however, groups, clubs, civic organizations etc. to satisfy the same itch. The problem with finding humanist groups is the size of our community. It’s growing but it isn’t as large as those of the religious communities. And once again, as many forum members have reminded us, an atheist is someone who has no belief in a god, period. That doesn’t make us cold hearted robotic theist haters it just means we can be humans who care about our fellow man free of divine condemnation if we don’t. Or the old cliche, “good without god”. Give us time and we’ll meet more often. Meantime, hanging out here sure as hell helps.


Cap’t Jack

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One good schoolmaster is of more use than a hundred priests.

Thomas Paine

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Posted: 05 December 2012 10:14 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 70 ]
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Looking forward to that kind of future humanism then.

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Posted: 16 December 2012 04:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 71 ]
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what do you mean by good? if you mean good in the sense of promoting freedom and justice, then I would say yes. for martin luther king jr, mahatma ghandi, martin luther, john calvin and many other religious leaders through out history religious belief was central to their cause

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Posted: 16 December 2012 05:46 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 72 ]
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I heard Ghandi was also succeful with the ladies. So he got India and girls. Even Luther enjoyed women as much as he despised the Catholics. Religion can be awesome.  grin

[ Edited: 16 December 2012 08:59 PM by George ]
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Posted: 16 December 2012 07:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 73 ]
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I heard Ghandi was also succeful with the ladies. So got India and girls. Even Luther enjoyed women as much as he despised the Catholics. Religion can be awesome. 


Yeah, and Luther thumbed his nose at Catholic tradition and went and married a nun. Ripped her from the arms of the church he did. Wasn’t very fond of Jews though.

 

Cap’t Jack

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One good schoolmaster is of more use than a hundred priests.

Thomas Paine

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Posted: 16 December 2012 09:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 74 ]
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what do you mean by good? if you mean good in the sense of promoting freedom and justice, then I would say yes. for martin luther king jr, mahatma ghandi, martin luther, john calvin and many other religious leaders through out history religious belief was central to their cause

The exact same can be said of Crusaders who tried to take over Palestine, Tomas De Torquemada (A key figure in The Spanish Inquistion), those in the south who advocated slavery, Adold Hitler who used it to justify Nazism, and the Ku Klux Klan.

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Posted: 17 December 2012 09:30 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 75 ]
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deros - 27 September 2012 05:24 AM

There is no way we will all ever agree on that but this is an article, though short on giving reasons, says no.

http://machineslikeus.com/news/religion-good-anything-0

The only thing religion is good for is for controlling the masses.  And that’s what it’s been used for most of the time, in democracies as well as dictatorships. It evidently works well.

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