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Romney and Republicans cheer climate change
Posted: 03 November 2012 05:22 PM   [ Ignore ]
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From Climate Silence on YouTube.

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“In the beginning, God created the universe. This has made many people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.”
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Posted: 20 November 2012 06:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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Romney and the laughing Republicans remind me of all the ignorant people laughing at the thought that a ship like the Titanic could sink. I’m very glad that the majority of the American voters elected a president who respects scientists. The ultra-conservative folks will lose their American war on science, but not without casualties.

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Posted: 20 November 2012 06:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Surely the sinking of Titanic was a good thing. How else could those who survived experience a joy from not sinking? And the Republican party is as much a part of our universe as is the interstellar space, so it must be good.

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Posted: 20 November 2012 06:42 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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dansmith62 - 20 November 2012 06:23 AM

Romney and the laughing Republicans remind me of all the ignorant people laughing at the thought that a ship like the Titanic could sink. I’m very glad that the majority of the American voters elected a president who respects scientists. The ultra-conservative folks will lose their American war on science, but not without casualties.

And just in the nick of time. Among other reasons this election was so important is our need to reduce our carbon emissions now, not in 10 or 20 years. We are nearing a tipping point where, once crossed, nothing we do can reverse of even slow global warming. We need to act immediately. Obama’s reelecting, combined with last summer’s record heat and Hurricane Sandy has opened a policy window where we might actually make some progress.

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Posted: 20 November 2012 07:12 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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I call BS…show me some evidence ( not a weak climate model) that we are at a ‘tipping point’. Scaremongering I say….oh no…things might not look so bad…but wait what if we are at the tipping point where once reached we can never go back….never go back…..well where is your evidence for a tipping point ?

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Posted: 20 November 2012 07:24 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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Open your eyes sine dues. You want evidence? Look at how the weather patterns have changed in just the past 30 years. I provided links for you to read in another thread. Apparently you ignored them. And those “weak” computer models have produced extremely accurate predictions. Are you familiar with James Hansen’s presentation before Congress in 1988?

More evidence: melting Arctic Ice, glaciers retreating worldwide, record wildfires in 2011 and 2012, record heat in 2011 and 2012, Hurricane Sandy, the first decade of the 21st Century being the hottest decade on record despite the Sun being unusually quiet…

This is important. Climate change is a clear and present danger, not some abstract possibility a decade or two down the road. If we don’t reduce our carbon emissions significantly our children and grandchildren will suffer greatly. People are already suffering the effects of climate change around the world.

Maldives, Ground Zero for Climate Change Impacts

We in the United States are largely responsible for climate change, and the people who are least responsible are suffering the most. Denying climate change is a danger is not only short-sighted, it is immoral.

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Posted: 20 November 2012 08:12 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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You sound like a guilt-ridden soul….
....weather is not climate….
I did read some off the links that you provided…thank-you. A great deal of info to chew through.

The models are not accurate ! Weather and climate are non-linear systems….

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Posted: 20 November 2012 08:15 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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You’re not gonna’ win, Sine.

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Posted: 20 November 2012 08:26 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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sine dues - 20 November 2012 08:12 AM

...weather is not climate…

Thank you Captain Obvious. If you take the time to actually read what I wrote you’ll see I know the difference. Read this sentence again, “Look at how the weather patterns have changed in just the past 30 years.” That is changing climate.

I did read some off the links that you provided…thank-you. A great deal of info to chew through.

Yes, there is a lot to chew through. Keep an open mind as you read what climate scientists have to say and look around at what is happening. What the computer models predicted 20 and 30 years ago is happening all around us.

The models are not accurate ! Weather and climate are non-linear systems….

The observed warming trend fell in the center of the range Hansen predicted in 1988. The models are accurate.

Edit: corrected a couple of typos.

[ Edited: 20 November 2012 07:51 PM by DarronS ]
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Posted: 20 November 2012 08:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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I dont know enough of what I am talking about. Most of you won’t admit that. I am not a climate scientist ( or any kind of scientist) so I cannot with any real conviction dispute or support climate research in any useful way. I may be ignorant but I am not stupid. The weather has been much worse and much better in the past. We can not control climate. Sandy was not due to AGW. It was a big storm. Look up hurricanes in the past…..1931-China Hankow-2,000,000 feared dead in flooding
        1931-Canada worst known drought-record temps kill 50 people
        1933 Alabama 214 dead in worst tornado
Were these signs of global warming?

What about the TRUE driver of temperature ?..........The sun

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Posted: 20 November 2012 08:40 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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The last time in Earth’s history that CO2 levels were as high as they are now, sea levels were 20 meters higher than they are now. The question many scientists are asking themselves is: How long does it take for sea level to rise?  If it takes a century or longer, then we have a chance, if it takes less than that, we’re boned. I’m betting we’re going to see large scale geoengineering projects start up in the next decade, with unforeseen consequences from those projects making themselves known shortly after.

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Posted: 20 November 2012 08:40 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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I do know enough of what I am talking about on this subject. I am majoring in Environmental Policy & Communications and taking the same environmental science classes as my ES major colleagues, just not the biology and chemistry classes. I just finished a short research paper on the politics surrounding climate change, and am familiar with the lies and deflection tactics the PR agencies hired by energy companies use to spread just the sort of confusion you repeat here.

Ninety-eight precent of active climate change researchers believe mankind’s carbon emissions are driving global warming, yet you choose to believe the agents of doubt. Your last question is an example of a deflection tactic. Now I really am off to finish my conflict resolution paper.

Edit: corrected a typo

[ Edited: 20 November 2012 08:46 AM by DarronS ]
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Posted: 20 November 2012 09:23 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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I dont know enough of what I am talking about. Most of you won’t admit that. I am not a climate scientist ( or any kind of scientist) so I cannot with any real conviction dispute or support climate research in any useful way. I may be ignorant but I am not stupid. The weather has been much worse and much better in the past. We can not control climate. Sandy was not due to AGW. It was a big storm. Look up hurricanes in the past…..1931-China Hankow-2,000,000 feared dead in flooding
        1931-Canada worst known drought-record temps kill 50 people
        1933 Alabama 214 dead in worst tornado
Were these signs of global warming?

What about the TRUE driver of temperature ?..........The sun


So you want us to admit that you don’t know what you’re talking about? Ok, you’ve convinced me, you don’t know what you’re talking about. You don’t need to be a “climate scientist” to do your own research and either prove or refute your contention. So far I’m not seeing any proof that we’re all just a pack of chicken littles using histrionics to make a point. Despite the many references Darron has sited you still deny climate change by referencing 60+ ya hurricanes. Carbon based energy predates that by over a hundred. We’ve Been pumping co2 into the air since the beginning of the 19th Century and it has finally begun to have a profound effect on the climate and the weather patterns in turn. BTW a flood of the Yellow River in 1913 killed 4 million while we’re citing superlative stats. Sandy is noteworthy not just due to the devastation it wrought but the power it displayed. In some areas in Jersey and Long Island the shoreline was moved inland several feet and scientists warn that if it is rebuilt it will happen again as that is now the permanent shore. Here’s another log on the pile of references if you’re interested. And the pile just keeps getting bigger and bigger.

 

http://www.gi.alaska.edu/AlaskaScienceForum/article/eroding-islands-disappearing-glaciers-lots-greenhouse-gases

 


Cap’t Jack

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Posted: 21 November 2012 07:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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Could you answer my objection to a ‘tipping point’ ?

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Posted: 21 November 2012 12:12 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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sine dues - 20 November 2012 08:31 AM

I dont know enough of what I am talking about. Most of you won’t admit that. I am not a climate scientist ( or any kind of scientist) so I cannot with any real conviction dispute or support climate research in any useful way. I may be ignorant but I am not stupid.

A big part of this problem for everyone is choosing which authorities to trust and which to distrust. I think that you know a fair amount - but we have diagreements about which information is reliable. So, that’s why we debate: to figure out whose information sources are more reliable. It’s also a great way to train our minds, to be able to present our information in an organized way that our debate ‘foes’ cannot misunderstand.

[ Edited: 21 November 2012 12:19 PM by TromboneAndrew ]
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Posted: 21 November 2012 12:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]
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sine dues - 20 November 2012 08:31 AM

I dont know enough of what I am talking about. Most of you won’t admit that. I am not a climate scientist ( or any kind of scientist) so I cannot with any real conviction dispute or support climate research in any useful way. I may be ignorant but I am not stupid. The weather has been much worse and much better in the past. We can not control climate. Sandy was not due to AGW. It was a big storm. Look up hurricanes in the past…..1931-China Hankow-2,000,000 feared dead in flooding
        1931-Canada worst known drought-record temps kill 50 people
        1933 Alabama 214 dead in worst tornado
Were these signs of global warming?

What about the TRUE driver of temperature ?..........The sun

How about the human and economic casualties of the Dust Bowl days?  Was that just the sun, or did humans have something to do with establishing the conditions for it?  How about Easter Island?  Was it just the sun that used up all the trees and made the previously established society of humans there to be no longer viable?

La la la la lah, we’re just humans,  la la la la lah, we’re not doing anything, la la la la lah, it’s all the sun’s fault, la la la la lah…

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