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Religious people less intelligent than atheists, study says
Posted: 16 August 2013 08:22 AM   [ Ignore ]
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http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/08/13/religious-people-less-intelligent-atheists-_n_3747511.html

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Posted: 17 August 2013 12:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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PZ Myers comments on this study

PZ has a few choice words on the study. Basically, don’t feel too superior, declaring yourself atheist doesn’t make you smarter. Also, he cites a different study and agrees with its conclusion that the issues are socioeconomic

But it’s not lack of intelligence that is at the heart of religion, it’s class and emotional/cultural/historical concerns. Poor performance on IQ tests is simply a side-effect of discrimination and deprivation.

So the solution is to reduce the disparity of classes. Always a good idea.

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Posted: 17 August 2013 10:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Lord how I loathe studies like this. I find them insulting and I’m a freaking atheist. They always reek of smug douchebaggery and confimation bias to me. I wish they’d stop making them, but it seems everyone likes “scientific” “proof” of how superior they are. Pfeh.

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Posted: 18 August 2013 11:58 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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Lausten - 17 August 2013 12:34 PM

PZ Myers comments on this study

PZ has a few choice words on the study. Basically, don’t feel too superior, declaring yourself atheist doesn’t make you smarter. Also, he cites a different study and agrees with its conclusion that the issues are socioeconomic

But it’s not lack of intelligence that is at the heart of religion, it’s class and emotional/cultural/historical concerns. Poor performance on IQ tests is simply a side-effect of discrimination and deprivation.

So the solution is to reduce the disparity of classes. Always a good idea.

No one said that declaring yourself an atheist would make you smarter. That is a ridiculous twisting of what the survey reported. What it said was that more people who declare themselves as atheists tend to have higher IQs than the general population.  That is a far cry from claiming that declaring yourself an atheist makes you smarter. This is why some surveys get a bad reputation. People refuse to understand what they are actually saying, unfortunately, some of them are journalists who should know better.

Lois

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Posted: 23 August 2013 04:20 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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You’re right about that, Lois. There are studies correlating advanced education with lowered belief in gods. Education itself does not make one smarter, but smarter people tend to seek education, and accumulating knowledge helps defeat superstition.

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Posted: 23 August 2013 04:55 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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Lord how I loathe studies like this. I find them insulting and I’m a freaking atheist. They always reek of smug douchebaggery and confimation bias to me. I wish they’d stop making them, but it seems everyone likes “scientific” “proof” of how superior they are. Pfeh.

Completely agree on that. Here in the Lil’ ‘Ol South, I deal with religious people all the time. These people are NOT stupid by any stretch of the imagination and in a debate can engage you on any level. What a lot of them are is INDOCTRINATED, and almost always from birth.

When you’ve been indoctrinated in a belief system and culture from before you’re even weaned from Mama’s breast, it’s extremely difficult to get past that. Even when you come to understand…deep down…that it’s all crap, it’s very hard to just throw it away. Intelligence has nothing to do with it.

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Posted: 23 August 2013 01:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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Equal Opportunity Curmudgeon - 23 August 2013 04:55 AM

Lord how I loathe studies like this. I find them insulting and I’m a freaking atheist. They always reek of smug douchebaggery and confimation bias to me. I wish they’d stop making them, but it seems everyone likes “scientific” “proof” of how superior they are. Pfeh.

Completely agree on that. Here in the Lil’ ‘Ol South, I deal with religious people all the time. These people are NOT stupid by any stretch of the imagination and in a debate can engage you on any level. What a lot of them are is INDOCTRINATED, and almost always from birth.

When you’ve been indoctrinated in a belief system and culture from before you’re even weaned from Mama’s breast, it’s extremely difficult to get past that. Even when you come to understand…deep down…that it’s all crap, it’s very hard to just throw it away. Intelligence has nothing to do with it.

Well, I think intelligence is one factor in a sea of factors. We never know for sure what motivates a person to maintain a religius belief or reject it. It is never one factor.  It’s the same with all human decisions.

But the study did show that atheists score higher on IQ tests than the general population.

Lois

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Posted: 23 August 2013 01:40 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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But the study did show that atheists score higher on IQ tests than the general population.

I’m sure it did, but when you have to factor in a possible bias on the part of the ones doing the study, it doesn’t mean much.

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Posted: 23 August 2013 03:59 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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Lois - 23 August 2013 01:23 PM

But the study did show that atheists score higher on IQ tests than the general population.

Lois

Lois,

It may please you to know that you’re not the first to trumpet the ignorance of Christians.  In the 2nd century AD, Cornelius Celsus also made the charge, “This is one of their [the Christians’] rules. Let no man that is learned, wise, or prudent come among us: but if they be unlearned, or a child, or an idiot, let him freely come. So they openly declare that none but the ignorant, and those devoid of understanding, slaves, women, and children, are fit disciples for the God they worship.”  ~ Aulus Cornelius Celsus

It is true that Christ accepts all men and women who come to him, and Christians love all who come into their community.  It is love and acceptance, not an intelligence test that is required to be a Christian.  That’s why they sing silly songs like, “We will work with each other, we will work side by side
And we’ll guard each one’s dignity and save each one’s pride
And they’ll know we are Christians by our love…”

Loving your brother, your neighbor and even your enemy is a tough thing.  But that’s the goal of the Christian, not to score the best on an intelligence test.  Of course Celsus was exaggerating, today there are many very intelligent people in all walks of life that are Christian, and there are many who aren’t.  Sometimes the less intelligent among us teach us all a lesson on what it is to love.

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Posted: 23 August 2013 04:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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LilySmith - 23 August 2013 03:59 PM

Sometimes the less intelligent among us teach us all a lesson on what it is to love.

I prefer dogs to gods. Their messes are easier to clean.

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Posted: 23 August 2013 09:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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Equal Opportunity Curmudgeon - 23 August 2013 01:40 PM

But the study did show that atheists score higher on IQ tests than the general population.

I’m sure it did, but when you have to factor in a possible bias on the part of the ones doing the study, it doesn’t mean much.

There is “possible” bias in every study that has ever been done. Do we throw them all out?

What is the bias in this study? Can you point to a specific instances of it?


Lois

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Posted: 24 August 2013 06:35 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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I think IQ testing is only unscientific when it comes to the comparison of races. I don’t at least see the usual skeptics here to complain about IQ as when I bring up the topic of races.

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Posted: 24 August 2013 06:02 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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George - 24 August 2013 06:35 AM

I think IQ testing is only unscientific when it comes to the comparison of races.

  George, I’m so happy that you recogize that.  LOL LOL  LOL  (_e=mC2_)

Occam

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Posted: 24 August 2013 08:40 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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There is “possible” bias in every study that has ever been done. Do we throw them all out?

if it has an overwhelming effect on the results…yes.

What is the bias in this study? Can you point to a specific instances of it?

I didn’t say specifically that there was. I said when you factor in POSSIBLE bias, it doesn’t mean much. When any sort of objective peer review has been done, get back to me. (In the meantime, I think you doth protesteth too much, if only because you appear to WANT the study to be validated.)

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Posted: 24 August 2013 09:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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Equal Opportunity Curmudgeon - 24 August 2013 08:40 PM

There is “possible” bias in every study that has ever been done. Do we throw them all out?

if it has an overwhelming effect on the results…yes.

What is the bias in this study? Can you point to a specific instances of it?

I didn’t say specifically that there was. I said when you factor in POSSIBLE bias, it doesn’t mean much. When any sort of objective peer review has been done, get back to me. (In the meantime, I think you doth protesteth too much, if only because you appear to WANT the study to be validated.)

Give me one reason I or any atheist wouldn’t want it validated.  You, on the other hand, appear to NOT want it to be validated.  Why should that be?

Lois

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Posted: 24 August 2013 09:14 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]
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Occam. - 24 August 2013 06:02 PM
George - 24 August 2013 06:35 AM

I think IQ testing is only unscientific when it comes to the comparison of races.

  George, I’m so happy that you recogize that.  LOL LOL  LOL  (_e=mC2_)

Occam

A lot of people would deem it unscientific if their score comes out lower than they expected. In fact it’s the usual response. 

Lois

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