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What drives suicidal mass killers?
Posted: 23 September 2013 10:50 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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GdB - 23 September 2013 10:36 AM
Lois - 23 September 2013 10:31 AM

I did. I see no mention of scientific research.  I see opinions in articles and books.

Yes, you are right. It is just an opinion of criminologist. And Scott Atran is just an anthropologist who did research into the environment and psychology of terrorist suicide killers, e.g. by interviewing (not successful) suicide killers. Your opinion is as good as theirs, or even better.

(Missing the irony tags..)

The point is I can find as many citations from experts that support my contention as you can that support yours. So where does that leave us?

Your opinion is as good as theirs, or even better, evidently. (Missing the irony tags.)

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Posted: 23 September 2013 09:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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Lois - 23 September 2013 10:31 AM
GdB - 23 September 2013 10:23 AM
Lois - 23 September 2013 10:20 AM

Please cite the scientific research you allude to.

Read the OP.

I did. I see no mention of scientific research.  I see opinions in articles and books.

The point is it’s a controversial subject and there is no definitive evidence one way or another.  For every citation you provide that shows religion is not a contributing factor, I can provide equally reasonable citations that show it is.

“According to Juergensmeyer, religious terrorism consists of acts that terrify, the definition of which is provided by the witnesses - the ones terrified - and not by the party committing the act; accompanied by either a religious motivation, justification, organization, or world view. Religion is sometimes used in combination with other factors, and sometimes as the primary motivation. Religious Terrorism is intimately connected to current forces of geopolitics.

“Bruce Hoffman has characterized modern religious terrorism as having three traits:

“The perpetrators must use religious scriptures to justify or explain their violent acts or to gain recruits.
Clerical figures must be involved in leadership roles.
Perpetrators use apocalyptic images of destruction to justify the acts.“5

Juergensmeyer 2004, pp. 4–10.
Hoffman 1999, p. 90.
Arquilla et al. 1999, pp. 19–20

Cited in Wikipedia

You’ve got to make links clickable so we don’t have to search for them!

What if Bruce Hoffman is wrong? The traits he puts forward were not found among the angry Muslims Atran interviewed for the book.

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Posted: 23 September 2013 09:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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Lois - 23 September 2013 10:50 AM
GdB - 23 September 2013 10:36 AM
Lois - 23 September 2013 10:31 AM

I did. I see no mention of scientific research.  I see opinions in articles and books.

Yes, you are right. It is just an opinion of criminologist. And Scott Atran is just an anthropologist who did research into the environment and psychology of terrorist suicide killers, e.g. by interviewing (not successful) suicide killers. Your opinion is as good as theirs, or even better.

(Missing the irony tags..)

The point is I can find as many citations from experts that support my contention as you can that support yours. So where does that leave us?

Your opinion is as good as theirs, or even better, evidently. (Missing the irony tags.)

So far, Atran’s research on the subject is panning out more then say, Sam Harris’ research - which is opposite Atran’s.

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Posted: 24 September 2013 01:24 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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mid atlantic - 23 September 2013 09:07 PM

So far, Atran’s research on the subject is panning out more then say, Sam Harris’ research - which is opposite Atran’s.

Right. That’s the point. There are many opinions. There are not so many opinions based on research. The comparison with Sam Harris is enlightening. See e.g. Here He Goes Again: Sam Harris’s Falsehoods. (BTW, this is from the Website where Mark Sloan also contributes.)

And of course, Lois, you also read the ‘Criticism’ paragraph in your Wikipedia article, didn’t you?

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Posted: 28 September 2013 10:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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Also an interesting perspective from a Salafi e-book
Salaf]http://l.b5z.net/i/u/6103974/i/SalafiManhaj_NYPD.pdf]Salaf Manhaj [/url]
Shame the media does like reading academic works

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