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John Boehner: Worst Speaker of the House ever, so far
Posted: 06 October 2013 01:22 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 46 ]
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Bryan - 05 October 2013 09:49 PM
Write4U - 05 October 2013 05:27 PM

When I said minority I did not mean the minority party, I meant the small minority within the House republican majority is obstructing their own leadership.

I realized that.  The question still stands.

The shining light of “Governance by the People for the People” democracy is dimming fast

Again, the ACA is an unpopular law.  Why not delay the individual mandate for a year after the president has already delayed the employer mandate for a year?  Wait!  Maybe the president is guilty of ... sedition!  How dare he delay that duly passed law!

I see, by wanting to pass ACA, with slight modification is sedition. But NOT wanting to pass ACA at all is good governance?

Tortured logic!

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Posted: 06 October 2013 07:11 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 47 ]
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DarronS - 05 October 2013 06:02 PM

They are not only cowardly, they are liars and hypocrites. My congress critter, John Carter (R-TX) has been sending emails all week blaming the Democrats for this stalemate. Another esteemed Texas representative, Rep. Randy Neugebauer (R-TX) recently confronted a park service ranger and said the park service should be ashamed for closing the WWII Memorial. Video here. Note that Rep. Neugebauer is one of the Republicans who voted against the budget proposal.

Vyazma, I agree we need to raise our taxes. We should have universal health care and free tuition for college students. We also need to rebuild our infrastructure across the nation and provide more help for the poor. Sometimes I wish Jesus really was the Messiah and these were the End Time® so I could watch Jesus come riding out of the sky on his white horse and cast the right wing Republicans into Hell.

Oh yeah!  I’m sure that bolt of lightning would cast more than a few Democrats into the fiery inferno.
We’re getting there man.  This is the death throes of a bygone political system.  These are the spasmodic last days of the Republican party as we knew it.
And by last days I mean years.  They won’t go away overnight. But they are finished.

I actually meant the Dems were cowardly in my statement above.  I realized it didn’t convey that specifically after I sent it.
I figured what difference does it make?  They are all cowards.  Most of them anyways.
We are not being afforded democratic representation.

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Posted: 06 October 2013 07:26 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 48 ]
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Bryan - 05 October 2013 09:49 PM

Well, the House sent a bill to the Senate to fund FEMA but Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid is apparently heeding VYAZMA’s advice and refusing to allow a vote on the bill.  So it’ll clearly be all the Republicans’ fault if people die for lack of assistance from FEMA.  Or something.

Oh you mean the GOP wants to pass parts of a funding measure that would make them look better to their constituents?
No No NO!  In for a penny in for a pound!!!
I just hope they keep it shutdown!! Then default!  Please!
I’m gonna see these rats come begging on their hands and knees!
Arghhh!  Man!  I hope they don’t cave!
I’m praying to the tree in my front yard that they don’t cave!

And by the way Bryan, your goofy rhetoric seems so god damned hollow in context of all of this!
You don’t even realize it.  You’re using the kind of dopey talking points that only a slackjawed Fox watcher could relate to.

Again, the ACA is an unpopular law.  Why not delay the individual mandate for a year after the president has already delayed the employer mandate for a year?  Wait!  Maybe the president is guilty of ... sedition!  How dare he delay that duly passed law!

No Obamacare is a misunderstood law that will rapidly evolve into a well respected and understood law once more and more and more people start
taking advantage of it. Millions already have been taking advantage of Obamacare laws.
I guess you can continue to try and convince people Obamacare is bad though and unpopular.
You’ve got a few more futile months of that.  Then you’ll just sound tired and haggard.

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Posted: 06 October 2013 07:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 49 ]
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VYAZMA - 06 October 2013 07:26 AM

No Obamacare is a misunderstood law that will rapidly evolve into a well respected and understood law once more and more and more people start
taking advantage of it. Millions already have been taking advantage of Obamacare laws.

Bingo. The Republicans want to delay Obamacare until after the 2014 elections so they can continue spreading FUD and get themselves reelected. If people actually start using Obamacare and realize its benefits they may open their eyes and realize the Republicans have been hurting them all this time.

I guess you can continue to try and convince people Obamacare is bad though and unpopular.
You’ve got a few more futile months of that.  Then you’ll just sound tired and haggard.

Bryan has sound tired and haggard for a long time.

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Posted: 06 October 2013 07:39 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 50 ]
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Bryan-So it’ll clearly be all the Republicans’ fault if people die for lack of assistance from FEMA.  Or something.

These are the same GOP hijackers who voted No on hurricane relief for the East Coast a couple of years ago.
These are the same guys who want the government shutdown.
They got it.  Some of them have openly said they want a default too.
Let’s go there!
Not all voters are moronic middle-American FOX/Limbaugh zombies Bryan.
Many are business people and politicians and professionals.
Yeah, they are already seeing this for what it is.
Oh, the damage hasn’t even begun to be realized yet.
Anybody with two eyes and a brain have already seen that Obama and Reid have plainly offered to fund the govt and raise the debt ceiling!

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Posted: 06 October 2013 09:37 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 51 ]
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Write4U - 06 October 2013 01:22 AM
Bryan - 05 October 2013 09:49 PM
Write4U - 05 October 2013 05:27 PM

When I said minority I did not mean the minority party, I meant the small minority within the House republican majority is obstructing their own leadership.

I realized that.  The question still stands.

The shining light of “Governance by the People for the People” democracy is dimming fast

Again, the ACA is an unpopular law.  Why not delay the individual mandate for a year after the president has already delayed the employer mandate for a year?  Wait!  Maybe the president is guilty of ... sedition!  How dare he delay that duly passed law!

I see, by wanting to pass ACA, with slight modification is sedition. But NOT wanting to pass ACA at all is good governance?

Tortured logic!

The tortured logic is your straw man.

It’s a delay imperially instituted by the president (employer mandate) against a similar delay for the individual mandate.

You’ve done a pretty shameless job of avoiding the question.

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Posted: 06 October 2013 09:44 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 52 ]
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DarronS - 06 October 2013 07:31 AM

I guess you can continue to try and convince people Obamacare is bad though and unpopular.
You’ve got a few more futile months of that.  Then you’ll just sound tired and haggard.

Bryan has sound tired and haggard for a long time.

If the poll results won’t refute me, then just go for the personal attack!  Woohoo!

grin

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/obama_and_democrats_health_care_plan-1130.html

You don’t have anything to refute my argument that the health care law increases costs nationally, either. 

What a great way to get the economy back on track.  We’ll spend more on health care and raise taxes.  Great prescription.

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Posted: 06 October 2013 10:08 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 53 ]
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Bryan - 06 October 2013 09:44 AM

If the poll results won’t refute me, then just go for the personal attack!  Woohoo!

grin

You should learn to interpret poll results. That poll shows that some Americans are still confused about Obamacare
after being bombarded with anti-ACA propaganda for 3-4 years.
So go ahead and pat yourself on the back. The poll shows that y’alls BS has worked.
Hopefully the success of the ACA will reverse those trends.  And really, how could it not?

You don’t have anything to refute my argument that the health care law increases costs nationally, either. 

Can’t speak for Darron, but yes it’s just an argument. It isn’t fact, and can’t be looked at for a few years.
So you’re just making predictions that are slanted in an anti-ACA fashion.

What a great way to get the economy back on track.  We’ll spend more on health care and raise taxes.  Great prescription.

Sean Hannity?  Is that you?
For many people who will need the ACA the economy is never going to be “on track”.
The economy has never been “on track” for most people.

I’m curious, what’s your definition of on track?
And what is your prescription for getting the economy “on track”?

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Posted: 06 October 2013 01:37 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 54 ]
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First, I’ve been going going along with the title of this thread until a few seconds ago when it occurred to me that about a decade ago Neut Gingrich was Speaker of the House. snake

Second, the problem is how the polls are reported.  When Faux News/Bryan say only a minority are positive for the health care bill, they are correct, but they carefully ignore the more complete results.  They are as follows
                              Positive to             Negative to
Obama Care Act                   40%                  60%

Affordable health care Act           60%                  40%

What this really demonstrates is that people have been brainwashed against “Obama"care but like the idea of more available health care. 

But, don’t worry.  After it’s been successful for about four years, no Republican will be arguing to eliminate it.  Rather, they’ll all be bragging about how it was really their idea and that they are the ones who instituted it.  LOL

Occam

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Posted: 06 October 2013 05:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 55 ]
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Occam. - 06 October 2013 01:37 PM

Second, the problem is how the polls are reported.  When Faux News/Bryan say only a minority are positive for the health care bill, they are correct, but they carefully ignore the more complete results.  They are as follows
                              Positive to             Negative to
Obama Care Act                   40%                  60%

Affordable health care Act           60%                  40%

What this really demonstrates is that people have been brainwashed against “Obama"care but like the idea of more available health care. 

Source?  The aggregated poll results I linked had a comprehensive list, not just Fox News polling.  Only a couple of the polls showed approval.  The clear majority show disapproval, including the most recent one from CBS (Conservatives’ Broadcasting Service?):

“Q8. From what you’ve heard or read, do you approve or disapprove of the health care law that was enacted in 2010?”

Biased question?  Really?  Disapproval:  51 percent with 6 percent offering no opinion.

But, don’t worry.  After it’s been successful for about four years, no Republican will be arguing to eliminate it.  Rather, they’ll all be bragging about how it was really their idea and that they are the ones who instituted it.  LOL

I really don’t see how you can say that with a straight emoticon.  Sure, Heritage Foundation cooked up an idea similar to the individual mandate included in the ACA, but it never had wide support even as an alternative to HillaryCare.  The ACA has numerous features that conservatives will object to in principle now and in the future.  Our objections stem from economic principles.

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Posted: 06 October 2013 06:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 56 ]
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Bryan - 06 October 2013 05:01 PM
Occam. - 06 October 2013 01:37 PM

Second, the problem is how the polls are reported.  When Faux News/Bryan say only a minority are positive for the health care bill, they are correct, but they carefully ignore the more complete results.  They are as follows
                              Positive to             Negative to
Obama Care Act                   40%                  60%

Affordable health care Act           60%                  40%

What this really demonstrates is that people have been brainwashed against “Obama"care but like the idea of more available health care. 

Source?  The aggregated poll results I linked had a comprehensive list, not just Fox News polling.  Only a couple of the polls showed approval.  The clear majority show disapproval, including the most recent one from CBS (Conservatives’ Broadcasting Service?):

“Q8. From what you’ve heard or read, do you approve or disapprove of the health care law that was enacted in 2010?”

Biased question?  Really?  Disapproval:  51 percent with 6 percent offering no opinion.

But, don’t worry.  After it’s been successful for about four years, no Republican will be arguing to eliminate it.  Rather, they’ll all be bragging about how it was really their idea and that they are the ones who instituted it.  LOL

I really don’t see how you can say that with a straight emoticon.  Sure, Heritage Foundation cooked up an idea similar to the individual mandate included in the ACA, but it never had wide support even as an alternative to HillaryCare.  The ACA has numerous features that conservatives will object to in principle now and in the future.  Our objections stem from economic principles.

Yes, let’s discuss the Economic principles for children’s education, healthcare, and a stable economy on which to can found their dreams.

Obama has consistently reduced spending. His first act in office was a tax reduction and during his term there are 750,000 fewer Federal employees than when he took office. But it just ain’t good enough, not because he has done some positive things, but in spite of them.

You keep ignoring the a priori Declaration of “bringing down this president” when he took office. The rest of history can readily be found in the record. Deficit has been cut by 3.5 Trillion dollars. But no matter, Obamacare is gonna place electronic chips in your body and Obama death panels will decide who gets to live or die.

[ Edited: 06 October 2013 07:39 PM by Write4U ]
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Posted: 06 October 2013 07:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 57 ]
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Write4U - 06 October 2013 06:34 PM

Yes, let’s discuss the Economic principles for children’s education, healthcare, and a stable economy on which to can found their dreams.

What do you think will be left of our dreams when the national debt exceeds, say, 150 percent of GDP?  Keep right on borrowing and look forward to a brighter tomorrow?

Obama has consistently reduced spending.

That’s just not true.  The truth is Obama probably added more spending during his first year in office than any president in our history (perhaps combined).  FactCheck.org estimates FY 2009 spending (ordinarily counted to Bush) actually done by Obama at $200 million.  Most of that’s from the first stage of the ARRA (stimulus bill). (I should add) The deficit’s coming down now, temporarily, but that’s mostly because of the cessation of stimulus programs.  Obama has not taken any concrete steps to reform the main drivers of the deficit, with the sole exception of the soft cap on Medicare spending that passed as part of the PPACA.  Obama makes it look like he’s cutting spending by frontloading his spending.  And it’s not as if Obama deserves full credit for spending cuts that occur as a result of the sequester, is it?  Do you really want to give Obama credit for that?

His first act in office was a tax reduction

Partly true.  The ARRA included some tax cuts.  Even the Democrats agree that tax cuts can help stimulate the economy.  Unfortunately it didn’t take long for Democrats to lose focus on that truth.  But the ARRA also included a great deal of targeted spending.  Democrats used it as an excuse to fund projects that we’d ordinarily call “pork,” which were suddenly justified as a way to save the economy.

and during his term there are 750,000 fewer Federal employees than when he took office. But it just ain’t good enough, not because he has done some positive things, but in spite of them.

Where do you get this stuff?

The Bureau of Labor Statistics says you’re nuts.
Seasonally adjusted (not counting the Post Office):
Jan 2009:  2060 (thousands)
Aug 2013:  2148.9


Not Seasonally Adjusted (not counting the Post Office):
Jan 2009:  2035.4 (thousands)
Aug 2013:  2162.1

Explain yourself.

You keep ignoring the a priori Declaration of “bringing down this president” when he took office. The rest of history can readily be found in the record.

President Obama’s record is dismal if you don’t count his aggressive pursuit of greater government control of health care.  Unemployment’s high, (real) wages are dropping.  The economy is riding on the oil and gas sector right now and Obama’s fighting it.

Unemployment when Obama took office:  7.8 percent
Unemployment now:  7.3 percent (all-time low under Obama)

Average unemployment under Bush:  5.3 percent

If you want to make the case for the great job Obama has done, point to a statistic that isn’t made up.

[ Edited: 06 October 2013 07:46 PM by Bryan ]
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Posted: 06 October 2013 07:44 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 58 ]
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Bryan - 06 October 2013 09:44 AM
DarronS - 06 October 2013 07:31 AM

I guess you can continue to try and convince people Obamacare is bad though and unpopular.
You’ve got a few more futile months of that.  Then you’ll just sound tired and haggard.

Bryan has sound tired and haggard for a long time.

If the poll results won’t refute me, then just go for the personal attack!  Woohoo!

grin

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/obama_and_democrats_health_care_plan-1130.html

You don’t have anything to refute my argument that the health care law increases costs nationally, either. 

What a great way to get the economy back on track.  We’ll spend more on health care and raise taxes.  Great prescription.

You ignore those 15% of people who are opposed to ACA because it does NOT go far enough. That leaves opposition to Obamacare on economic grounds in the minority.

Moreover, another 20 % of those opposed do not know what is actually in ACA, except that Fox has told them it is bad law.

[ Edited: 06 October 2013 07:47 PM by Write4U ]
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Posted: 06 October 2013 07:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 59 ]
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[Bryan]Average unemployment under Bush:  5.3 percent.

Yes, the average over 8 years after inheriting a healthy economy with low unemployment from Clinton. What was unemployment when Bush left office and the few months following his exit? Your averages don’t mean anything.

That’s like saying, Bush drove the bus 10,000 miles before he ran it into the ditch and left it there for Obama to pull it out and get it repaired before it was able to go on the road to recovery.

[ Edited: 06 October 2013 09:58 PM by Write4U ]
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Posted: 06 October 2013 08:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 60 ]
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Write4U - 06 October 2013 07:44 PM

You ignore those 15% of people who are opposed to ACA because it does NOT go far enough. That leaves opposition to Obamacare on economic grounds in the minority.

That’s true.  Why is that distinction important with respect to a one-year delay for the individual mandate, which the Repubicans want to delay for a year to match the 1-year delay of the employer mandate recently decreed by Obama?

Moreover, another 20 % of those opposed do not know what is actually in ACA, except that Fox has told them it is bad law.

It doesn’t take Fox to tell people that it’s a bad law.  All it takes is evidence like the repeal of the 1099 provision, exposure of the effects of the medical device tax (see Sen. Al Franken), a dislike of the individual mandate, Obama’s imperial delay of the employer mandate, the poor performance of Exchange websites, the lack of background checks for Obamacare “navigators,” etc.

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