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US gun deaths
Posted: 09 April 2014 04:16 PM   [ Ignore ]
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I’ve heard that every one of Big Ben’s quarter-hour chimes marks another gun death in the US.

Shocking, if true, and it probably is. In fact, it’s probably short. 

Lois

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Posted: 09 April 2014 04:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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Maybe someone with experience of other countries outside of the US can chime in. The other day I was flipping through TV channels, and one after the other had some reference to violence. There was a movie, a TV show, history about some battle, even something on the Disney channel! It occurred to me, no wonder there’s so much violence in the US, it’s inescapable in our so called entertainment, and usually glorified. Do other countries have so much violence on TV? (And to those who will respond, violence on TV doesn’t cause someone to do violence I say bull…if what you watch on TV doesn’t influence one’s actions, why do so many companies spend so much on commercials?)

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Posted: 10 April 2014 12:46 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Violence in media, TV, video games, movies, etc. is not substantially lower in other countries out side the US. But gun violence is rampant here compared to other countries. I think there is a stronger correlation between gun violence, and the American love affair with guns and gun culture. And I think that love affair was concocted by the gun lobby, backed by gun vendors whose main impetus is to sell more and more guns. That lobby also helps pass laws that protect reckless gun use masked as ” a right to bear arms” dismissing the responsibility gun owners are held accountable for in other countries. The decision to buy a gun has been removed from the serious responsibility that decision “used” to include.

[ Edited: 10 April 2014 12:49 PM by Handydan ]
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Posted: 28 April 2014 04:13 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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CuthbertJ - 09 April 2014 04:34 PM

Maybe someone with experience of other countries outside of the US can chime in. The other day I was flipping through TV channels, and one after the other had some reference to violence. There was a movie, a TV show, history about some battle, even something on the Disney channel! It occurred to me, no wonder there’s so much violence in the US, it’s inescapable in our so called entertainment, and usually glorified. Do other countries have so much violence on TV? (And to those who will respond, violence on TV doesn’t cause someone to do violence I say bull…if what you watch on TV doesn’t influence one’s actions, why do so many companies spend so much on commercials?)

I have been watching violence on TV or movies of some sort nearly my entire life (57yrs) and I have never committed an act of violence. There are millions even billions exposed to violence on a daily basis and yet most all people are law abiding citizens. No, it is not a catalyst for guns or violence.

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Posted: 28 April 2014 04:20 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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Handydan - 10 April 2014 12:46 PM

Violence in media, TV, video games, movies, etc. is not substantially lower in other countries out side the US. But gun violence is rampant here compared to other countries. I think there is a stronger correlation between gun violence, and the American love affair with guns and gun culture. And I think that love affair was concocted by the gun lobby, backed by gun vendors whose main impetus is to sell more and more guns. That lobby also helps pass laws that protect reckless gun use masked as ” a right to bear arms” dismissing the responsibility gun owners are held accountable for in other countries. The decision to buy a gun has been removed from the serious responsibility that decision “used” to include.

Again, millions of people own guns. If those millions of people committed crimes with guns I would say there was a correlation but they don’t. Many factors go into people being violent and using guns to perform these acts of violence, ease of getting a weapon is but one of many, many reasons. Let’s address those issues, as well as mental health. Guns are a tool like any other, a means to an end, the perpetrator is the culprit not the tool.

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Posted: 28 April 2014 05:54 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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I don’t actually think gun control is the problem. I think a lack of legal responsibility for owning and using guns is more the problem.

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Posted: 28 April 2014 06:14 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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MzLee - 28 April 2014 04:20 PM
Handydan - 10 April 2014 12:46 PM

Violence in media, TV, video games, movies, etc. is not substantially lower in other countries out side the US. But gun violence is rampant here compared to other countries. I think there is a stronger correlation between gun violence, and the American love affair with guns and gun culture. And I think that love affair was concocted by the gun lobby, backed by gun vendors whose main impetus is to sell more and more guns. That lobby also helps pass laws that protect reckless gun use masked as ” a right to bear arms” dismissing the responsibility gun owners are held accountable for in other countries. The decision to buy a gun has been removed from the serious responsibility that decision “used” to include.

Again, millions of people own guns. If those millions of people committed crimes with guns I would say there was a correlation but they don’t. Many factors go into people being violent and using guns to perform these acts of violence, ease of getting a weapon is but one of many, many reasons. Let’s address those issues, as well as mental health. Guns are a tool like any other, a means to an end, the perpetrator is the culprit not the tool.

Nobody has ever been shot by a gun when a gun wasn’t available.

Here’s an exercise for everyone who thinks Americans should have the right to bear arms.

Make a list of your loved ones and acquaintances you would be upset to lose by gunshot Put yourself on the list.  Check off the names you would be willing to sacrifice for the right of people to be armed. Make copies of the lists. Head it THESE ARE THE PEOPLE I WOULD BE WILLING TO SEE SHOT FOR THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS.  Pass them out to each of your loved ones and acquaintances and to the parents of the children you would be willing to sacrifice. Renew the list every six months.

Lois

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Posted: 28 April 2014 06:54 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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MzLee - 28 April 2014 04:20 PM

Again, millions of people own guns. If those millions of people committed crimes with guns I would say there was a correlation but they don’t.

Lois-One of Big Ben’s quarter-hour chimes marks another gun death in the US.

The title of the thread is gun deaths, not gun crimes.
Nonetheless, a good percentage of those gun deaths are due to crimes. Many more are tragic accidents.

So seeing as how the title of the thread is Gun Deaths, I see a definite correlation between…
“Millions of people own guns” and “every quarter hour someone dies from a gun.”

Seems like a correlation to me…have you read the Chicago Tribune in the past year or so?

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Posted: 28 April 2014 06:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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Lois - 28 April 2014 06:14 PM
MzLee - 28 April 2014 04:20 PM
Handydan - 10 April 2014 12:46 PM

Violence in media, TV, video games, movies, etc. is not substantially lower in other countries out side the US. But gun violence is rampant here compared to other countries. I think there is a stronger correlation between gun violence, and the American love affair with guns and gun culture. And I think that love affair was concocted by the gun lobby, backed by gun vendors whose main impetus is to sell more and more guns. That lobby also helps pass laws that protect reckless gun use masked as ” a right to bear arms” dismissing the responsibility gun owners are held accountable for in other countries. The decision to buy a gun has been removed from the serious responsibility that decision “used” to include.

Again, millions of people own guns. If those millions of people committed crimes with guns I would say there was a correlation but they don’t. Many factors go into people being violent and using guns to perform these acts of violence, ease of getting a weapon is but one of many, many reasons. Let’s address those issues, as well as mental health. Guns are a tool like any other, a means to an end, the perpetrator is the culprit not the tool.

Nobody has ever been shot by a gun when a gun wasn’t available.

Here’s an exercise for everyone who thinks Americans should have the right to bear arms.

Make a list of your loved ones and acquaintances you would be upset to lose by gunshot Put yourself on the list.  Check off the names you would be willing to sacrifice for the right of people to be armed. Make copies of the lists. Head it THESE ARE THE PEOPLE I WOULD BE WILLING TO SEE SHOT FOR THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS.  Pass them out to each of your loved ones and acquaintances and to the parents of the children you would be willing to sacrifice. Renew the list every six months.

Lois

False equivalency is a distraction not an answer nor a solution.

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Posted: 28 April 2014 09:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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Lois - 28 April 2014 06:14 PM

Nobody has ever been shot by a gun when a gun wasn’t available.

Lois

No one has even been run over by a car when cars weren’t available. Here’s an exercise. Check off the names of those you’d be willing to sacrifice to make your life more convenient…

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Posted: 29 April 2014 03:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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MzLee - 28 April 2014 06:55 PM
Lois - 28 April 2014 06:14 PM
MzLee - 28 April 2014 04:20 PM
Handydan - 10 April 2014 12:46 PM

Violence in media, TV, video games, movies, etc. is not substantially lower in other countries out side the US. But gun violence is rampant here compared to other countries. I think there is a stronger correlation between gun violence, and the American love affair with guns and gun culture. And I think that love affair was concocted by the gun lobby, backed by gun vendors whose main impetus is to sell more and more guns. That lobby also helps pass laws that protect reckless gun use masked as ” a right to bear arms” dismissing the responsibility gun owners are held accountable for in other countries. The decision to buy a gun has been removed from the serious responsibility that decision “used” to include.

Again, millions of people own guns. If those millions of people committed crimes with guns I would say there was a correlation but they don’t. Many factors go into people being violent and using guns to perform these acts of violence, ease of getting a weapon is but one of many, many reasons. Let’s address those issues, as well as mental health. Guns are a tool like any other, a means to an end, the perpetrator is the culprit not the tool.

Nobody has ever been shot by a gun when a gun wasn’t available.

Here’s an exercise for everyone who thinks Americans should have the right to bear arms.

Make a list of your loved ones and acquaintances you would be upset to lose by gunshot Put yourself on the list.  Check off the names you would be willing to sacrifice for the right of people to be armed. Make copies of the lists. Head it THESE ARE THE PEOPLE I WOULD BE WILLING TO SEE SHOT FOR THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS.  Pass them out to each of your loved ones and acquaintances and to the parents of the children you would be willing to sacrifice. Renew the list every six months.

Lois

False equivalency is a distraction not an answer nor a solution.

What is then? You can call any argument “false equivalency,” especially useful if you can’t or won’t address it.

Lois

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Posted: 29 April 2014 03:17 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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DarronS - 28 April 2014 09:09 PM
Lois - 28 April 2014 06:14 PM

Nobody has ever been shot by a gun when a gun wasn’t available.

Lois

No one has even been run over by a car when cars weren’t available. Here’s an exercise. Check off the names of those you’d be willing to sacrifice to make your life more convenient…

I had thought better of you, Darron.

Lois

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Posted: 29 April 2014 03:50 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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There are no simple solutions to complex problems. No one wants a friend or family members to die violently;that’s a given. The “gun culture” in America began four centuries back and was well in place before the NRA was even thought of so it’s more of a symptom than a cause. And as to the manufacturers controlling the organization, you have but to research the Smith and Wesson Company to see the impact the NRA has on the industry. it’s definitely the other way round. the Manufacturers are controlled by the customers. I’m not defending the organization; I personally think that Wayne LaPierre, their spokesman is a media whore who likes the sound of his own voice (one wonders why he hasn’t run for a political office in a red State) but there are NRA members who claim they don’t like him either. BTW owning a gun doesn’t make one a killer salivating to shoot another human. There are people of that ilk however; they’re called psychopaths and they use whatever weapon is available to them. And that’s the very reason that the gun laws must be enforced Nationally. Taking guns out of the hands of the mentally ill should be a first priority. I know that’s a red flag to conservatives, but until we have a set of standard laws covering every State these people will slip through the cracks of lax state laws and the killing will continue.


Cap’t Jack

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Posted: 29 April 2014 04:14 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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DarronS - 28 April 2014 09:09 PM
Lois - 28 April 2014 06:14 PM

Nobody has ever been shot by a gun when a gun wasn’t available.

Lois

No one has even been run over by a car when cars weren’t available. Here’s an exercise. Check off the names of those you’d be willing to sacrifice to make your life more convenient…

lol, I thought the very same thing.

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Posted: 29 April 2014 04:18 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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Thevillageatheist - 29 April 2014 03:50 AM

There are no simple solutions to complex problems. No one wants a friend or family members to die violently;that’s a given. The “gun culture” in America began four centuries back and was well in place before the NRA was even thought of so it’s more of a symptom than a cause. And as to the manufacturers controlling the organization, you have but to research the Smith and Wesson Company to see the impact the NRA has on the industry. it’s definitely the other way round. the Manufacturers are controlled by the customers. I’m not defending the organization; I personally think that Wayne LaPierre, their spokesman is a media whore who likes the sound of his own voice (one wonders why he hasn’t run for a political office in a red State) but there are NRA members who claim they don’t like him either. BTW owning a gun doesn’t make one a killer salivating to shoot another human. There are people of that ilk however; they’re called psychopaths and they use whatever weapon is available to them. And that’s the very reason that the gun laws must be enforced Nationally. Taking guns out of the hands of the mentally ill should be a first priority. I know that’s a red flag to conservatives, but until we have a set of standard laws covering every State these people will slip through the cracks of lax state laws and the killing will continue.


Cap’t Jack

Agreed, also, until we actually enforce the laws we already have (which we don’t nationally or otherwise) how do we know we need more. The laws are on the books but they are mostly ignored as pointless or unenforceable.

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Posted: 29 April 2014 04:20 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]
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Lois - 29 April 2014 03:17 AM
DarronS - 28 April 2014 09:09 PM
Lois - 28 April 2014 06:14 PM

Nobody has ever been shot by a gun when a gun wasn’t available.

Lois

No one has even been run over by a car when cars weren’t available. Here’s an exercise. Check off the names of those you’d be willing to sacrifice to make your life more convenient…

I had thought better of you, Darron.

Lois

So it’s okay for you to use that analogy but not someone else? 0.o

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