Urgent need to redefine human values based on the rationality of a better future for all
Posted: 26 June 2016 05:24 AM   [ Ignore ]
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MY INTEREST as a thinker is in inventing the society next, which
1) will establish an universal framework of human values as opposed to the preoccupation of the contemporary society with human rights
2) will eschew individualism and promote the realisation of collective good that does not undermine human motivation; and
3) will define and codify ethics and morals based on the rationality of a better future instead of leaning on religious and cultural crutches.

I believe that it is eminently possible to establish an universal framework of human values independently of religious moorings, cultural foundations and political overhangs.

I have been working on my theories for over three decades and now keen to share my ideas with those who have an open mind and are committed to creating a better future for all.

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Posted: 26 June 2016 02:37 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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That’s a big goal Q. As someone who realized, as a young person in the 70’s, that I couldn’t depend on my culture to provide me with a moral system, I’ve given this a bit of thought. Looking forward to fleshing out these ideas.

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Posted: 27 June 2016 04:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Quescence - 26 June 2016 05:24 AM

MY INTEREST as a thinker is in inventing the society next, which
1) will establish an universal framework of human values as opposed to the preoccupation of the contemporary society with human rights
2) will eschew individualism and promote the realisation of collective good that does not undermine human motivation; and
3) will define and codify ethics and morals based on the rationality of a better future instead of leaning on religious and cultural crutches.

I believe that it is eminently possible to establish an universal framework of human values independently of religious moorings, cultural foundations and political overhangs.

I have been working on my theories for over three decades and now keen to share my ideas with those who have an open mind and are committed to creating a better future for all.

Nobel goal.  I’m with Lausten, curious to see what you come up with.

Although my first curiosity would be how do you see the next half century unfolding for humanity and the society it’s build up?

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Posted: 27 June 2016 06:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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Quescence - 26 June 2016 05:24 AM

MY INTEREST as a thinker is in inventing the society next, which
1) will establish an universal framework of human values as opposed to the preoccupation of the contemporary society with human rights
2) will eschew individualism and promote the realisation of collective good that does not undermine human motivation; and
3) will define and codify ethics and morals based on the rationality of a better future instead of leaning on religious and cultural crutches.

I believe that it is eminently possible to establish an universal framework of human values independently of religious moorings, cultural foundations and political overhangs.

I have been working on my theories for over three decades and now keen to share my ideas with those who have an open mind and are committed to creating a better future for all.

Noble goal.  I’m with Lausten, curious to see what you come up with.

Although my first curiosity would be how do you see the next half century unfolding for humanity, society particularly the actual dialogue between diverse peoples ?


Seems like everyone is hostile to new and challenging information - how do you entice curiosity?

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Posted: 27 June 2016 07:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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Quescence - 26 June 2016 05:24 AM

MY INTEREST as a thinker is in inventing the society next, which
1) will establish an universal framework of human values as opposed to the preoccupation of the contemporary society with human rights
2) will eschew individualism and promote the realisation of collective good that does not undermine human motivation; and
3) will define and codify ethics and morals based on the rationality of a better future instead of leaning on religious and cultural crutches.

I believe that it is eminently possible to establish an universal framework of human values independently of religious moorings, cultural foundations and political overhangs.

I have been working on my theories for over three decades and now keen to share my ideas with those who have an open mind and are committed to creating a better future for all.

Ok, what things from our current society will continue? Will we still have a money based economy? How do these values get proposed and accepted or ruled out? And, who gets to make those decissions? How are you defining human values?

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Posted: 27 June 2016 10:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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Quescence - 26 June 2016 05:24 AM

MY INTEREST as a thinker is in inventing the society next, which
1) will establish an universal framework of human values as opposed to the preoccupation of the contemporary society with human rights
2) will eschew individualism and promote the realisation of collective good that does not undermine human motivation; and
3) will define and codify ethics and morals based on the rationality of a better future instead of leaning on religious and cultural crutches.

I believe that it is eminently possible to establish an universal framework of human values independently of religious moorings, cultural foundations and political overhangs.

I have been working on my theories for over three decades and now keen to share my ideas with those who have an open mind and are committed to creating a better future for all.

Some big plans you’ve got there,one wouldn’t know where to even begin.

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Posted: 28 June 2016 12:38 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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Quescence - 26 June 2016 05:24 AM

MY INTEREST as a thinker is in inventing the society next, which
1) will establish an universal framework of human values as opposed to the preoccupation of the contemporary society with human rights
2) will eschew individualism and promote the realisation of collective good that does not undermine human motivation; and
3) will define and codify ethics and morals based on the rationality of a better future instead of leaning on religious and cultural crutches.

I believe that it is eminently possible to establish an universal framework of human values independently of religious moorings, cultural foundations and political overhangs.

I have been working on my theories for over three decades and now keen to share my ideas with those who have an open mind and are committed to creating a better future for all.

Just one thing: how do you get people to accept your ideas and put them into practice?

LL

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Posted: 28 June 2016 02:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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I tried checking out your website but it “couldn’t be reached”. I’m on about as high of bandwidth as you get, so I think it’s on your end.

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Posted: 28 June 2016 10:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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Lausten - 26 June 2016 02:37 PM

That’s a big goal Q. As someone who realized, as a young person in the 70’s, that I couldn’t depend on my culture to provide me with a moral system, I’ve given this a bit of thought. Looking forward to fleshing out these ideas.

I do look forward to building on this conversation with an open mind.  I have more or less finalised my views but still need to take time to frame these in an apolitical context and communicate these in a non offensive manner.  There are mental walls that these ideas will need to penetrate through and that is a big challenge. Hopefully, I would be able to engage people intellectually without abetting their resistance in any way

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Posted: 28 June 2016 10:44 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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I am not at all underestimating the challenges of transitioning from the comfort zone of democratic capitalism, which while asserting the liberties of individuals has weakened foundations of collective good. Sustainable societal progress requires that there is a dynamically fair trade off between the rights and liberties of individuals and the inescapable requirements of collective good.

I am really happy to see so many questions already.  I would certainly attempt to respond to every one of the concerns expressed and gain insights into your perspectives. However, I would request you to bear with me for the delays, on my part, in responding to your comments. I need to find time from my professional commitments, which I can do mostly during weekends.

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Posted: 28 June 2016 10:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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Although my first curiosity would be how do you see the next half century unfolding for humanity and the society it’s build up?

citizenschallenge.pm

I believe half a century is too short a time frame for meaningful societal change.  Transformational ideas always take long to become social norms. No doubt, internet has made it somewhat easier to communicate but common people are too preoccupied with gossip to find the time to think about critical societal issues.

Active minds also remain confounded by callous self interest and they often refuse to pay attention to issues that do not promise a quick return on the time invested. Most intellectuals also are lost in their own worlds. Therefore, it is not going to be easy for new ideas to gain the mind space which these deserve. What I have observed is that people become highly immune to new ideas particularly when the going is good in their personal spheres.  Only catastrophes trigger the search for alternatives. However, the changes that follow such catastrophes only create new sets of problems. In my view, reactionary change that characterises contemporary society is its most dangerous trait.

But, the next fifty years is not going to be quiet. In several ways it will be repeat of the past fifty years and the only saving grace is that there will not be any global wars that characterised the earlier fifty years.  People would tend to get too preoccupied with more of national problems than international problems thanks to the economic inequalities that are exacerbating.  Economics has got it all wrong and without an end to the worsening economic woes, society can never be at ease.

The current society is over-reliant on politics and seems to have reconciled to majoritorianism and both these factors would limit the capacity of the contemporary society to change. The biggest problem is that people in general have have no idea of the changes that they need to embrace. In the absence of universally valid principles of right and wrong, people are conveniently leaning on situational rationality which creates situations in which both the parties to any conflict not only claim but also sincerely believe that they are right.

In my view, there is no silver lining. Things can only get worse in the next fifty years unless tranformational ideas are seeded right way. We need to encourage people to think about the root causes of the problems as opposed to the superficial logic that people adopt most frequently these days.

We need an apolitical and agnostic approach aimed at awakening the minds. Societal problems are always the result of the mindsets of people. The world will have to find a way to transform mindsets and give it a greater and deeper sense of right and wrong.

[ Edited: 30 June 2016 01:30 AM by Quescence ]
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Posted: 29 June 2016 12:11 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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Handydan. Ok, what things from our current society will continue? Will we still have a money based economy?

There are no doubt,  many things that the current society will need to give up but, the extent to which it will give up will depend upon the willingness of people to change for the better. 

In most circumstances, interests of the individual come into conflict with the interests of collective good. At the same time, there are can be no accretion of collective good without individual contributions. The world needs to establish a mechanism of dynamically fair trade off, which simultaneously has a positive influence on the economic performance of societies.

I am glad that you have drawn attention to money based economy.  Monetary instruments are major culprits. These enable, perpetuate and aggravate unfair trade off   among individuals and between the society and individuals. It will take time replace money as an accounting unit.  How ever imperfect, we would need some kind of a monetary scale to aid the process of economic exchanges.

The real problem with money based economy is not with respect to money in its role as an accounting unit but because of its use as a store of value. Money, in this context, must be understood in its broadest sense to include the entire paper economy.  In a money-less economy, unfair economic exchanges can take place only with the help of plundering. But, inside a monetised economy, there are several mechanisms of legitimised plundering.

The so called market mechanism brings into play an innocuous sounding pricing principle of opportunity cost that creates havoc for the real economy. Opportunity cost based pricing transfers values to people who do not produce it.  If I am sitting in front of my stock trading application and making money, I certainly do not create real wealth but only create claims on the wealth created by others.

There is no hope for sustainable economic progress without giving up the unfair money making mechanisms prevailing in the paper economy.

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Posted: 29 June 2016 11:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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Handydan

How do these values get proposed and accepted or ruled out? And, who gets to make those decisions?

LoisL

How do you get people to accept your ideas and put them into practice?

Human values need to be discovered in the very same way any scientific invention takes place. It has to be part of the conscious effort that people make towards inventing the society next.

Human values cannot be proposed as precepts handed down by any individual or groups, how ever noble or powerful such persons might be.  Truths live by themselves and do not need the support or approval of any other. It is for the humans to find these individually and collectively.

Knowledge of truths benefits humans. It is by knowing the truth that a certain mosquito bite causes malaria, people could invent an antidote for such infection. Humans are better off by knowing more and more of truths.

The very same logic applies to human values as well. It is by discovering and learning the truths about human values, quality of life can improve.

Discovery truths can be as simple as a sudden spark inside the brain or a long drawn process involving years and years of research. It is simultaneously a function of the pre-existing knowledge and forward thinking. Truth might elude our grasp still, in spite of the rigorous methods we adopt, if we are not open towards it and are not absolutely honest and sincere in its pursuit. Truth reveals itself only to those who seek it without having any preconceived notions or prejudices that filter out that the facts reaching the brain.

There are of course a few inherent limitations in the process.

1) Even after discovering truths, it will need to be communicated appropriately for benefiting from it maximally.  While one might benefit personally from any discovery of truth, maximum benefits would accrue only when it is utilised by the society as a whole.
2) Social acceptance of truths takes time depending upon the relevant urgencies as well as the vested interests working against these. Since truths are discovered by individuals, who will be in a minority initially, established social groups might torpedo its social acceptance.
3) Societies and human mindsets have not matured adequately to recognise truth independently by disassociating it from the persons who discover it. Most mindsets are attuned to judging facts based on the profile of its advocates. People will need to develop an attitude for evaluating truths independently of its proponents.
4) Knowledge of truths can never be absolute. Planet earth was once considered to be the centre of universe. The more open and willing people are towards understanding newer postulates and evaluating these objectively, greater will be the chances for the world to become a better place for all.

The above process applies to the discovery of truths about human values as well.

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Posted: 30 June 2016 07:20 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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Just a suggestion. If you want to convince people of things, you might want to work on your writing skills. I have to constantly interpret your grammar. Sorry if that is because English is not your first language, I highly regard those who can command a second language. You are fine for communicating basic data, but you are talking about getting into difficult and emotionally charged territory. People will demand a lot from you.

You may also want to bone up on the concepts you are discussing. What you describe is “moral realism”. It is a theory that is developing a consensus and one I particularly like. When discussing philosophy, people expect that you have done your research and can respond to the criticism of your ideas that are already out there.

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