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Are they really due to Western foreign policies?
Posted: 29 October 2016 01:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 46 ]
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Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 27 October 2016 07:09 PM

Ashraf and Ajlaf caste distinction is a corruption of the Indian sub-continental Muslims by the Hindu caste system of that land. It is like giving up bad habits/traditions is hard. Islam does not have a caste system.

The inferior status of women in Islam is not really caste system; it is gender inequality - injustice and hatred against women.

oh, that makes it perfectly all right then. All is well!

Of course, the Muslims against Muslims discontent, hatred and violence in many parts of the world are mostly due to their disagreements on what is Islam and on who is following Islam properly and who is not. No other religious group suffers so much due to this kind of intra-religion disagreements.

What difference does it make what causes it? It exists and it is destructive to millions of lives. Nothing anyone says or does is going to stop Muslim against Muslim discontent or Islamic-inspired terrorism or discrimination or reactions against any of it.

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Posted: 30 October 2016 08:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 47 ]
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Atrocities on Hindus by Muslim mobs in Bangladesh on October 30, 2016:

http://www.thedailystar.net/country/rampage-over-hindus-bbaria-1306723

An alleged Facebook post denigrating the Kaaba made these people crazy, and they attacked a community! (Kaaba is the symbol, located in Saudi Arabia, that Muslims all over the world face for praying.) Did the whole community denigrate the Kaaba? Surely not. Don’t these Islamic fanatics need to be humans and stop committing atrocities for their imbecilic feelings of loyalty/duty to their religion?

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Posted: 30 October 2016 08:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 48 ]
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Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 29 October 2016 04:37 AM

I would not recognize declaring atheists as terrorists/criminals ‘rational’. In the world that is worth its human intelligence and civilization, there should be no law to praise/promote religion or to denigrate/criminalize lack of religion. Any kind of offence against the so-called God/gods or against the preaching of the so-called prophets should be left for the so-called God/gods to act on.

What you post makes common sense.
 
What is rational sense about the thinking is that Saudi Arabia is mostly ruled by god, or the word of god by the Prophet Mohammad. Or the rulings of past generations. If no ruling or word from god, then a ruling by an Islamic scholar is used.
 
So, just what is an atheist in America? One who does not believe in deities. Now what is an atheist in Saudi Arabia? Anyone questioning the fundamental beliefs of the Islamic religion as used by Saudi Arabia. Basically the Muslim Brotherhood is seen as atheists by Saudi Arabia laws now.
 
Now, the king knows he is dying. There are a lot of young Saudi men fighting in the wars in the region picking up outside religious ideas. The king wants the Saud family ruling power to be transferred to a new generation without any trouble. The king does not want any outside religious thinking to contest the transfer of Saud power to the next king. Therefore because atheists are not covered by god or past generations this atheist law is to preempt any trouble. And by any trouble that means anyone contesting the Saud transfer of power. It is not really about atheist in the way we think about atheists. It is all about keeping control of the Saud power. Does that make rational sense to you?

[ Edited: 30 October 2016 09:23 PM by MikeYohe ]
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Posted: 30 October 2016 09:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 49 ]
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Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 30 October 2016 08:19 PM

Atrocities on Hindus by Muslim mobs in Bangladesh on October 30, 2016:

http://www.thedailystar.net/country/rampage-over-hindus-bbaria-1306723

An alleged Facebook post denigrating the Kaaba made these people crazy, and they attacked a community! (Kaaba is the symbol, located in Saudi Arabia, that Muslims all over the world face for praying.) Did the whole community denigrate the Kaaba? Surely not. Don’t these Islamic fanatics need to be humans and stop committing atrocities for their imbecilic feelings of loyalty/duty to their religion?

The key to the problem is knowledge. The fact that the people are viewing Facebook shows that they have the ability to learn from the computer. If you take the time to break down the gods to the root of their power. You will find that it is some form of knowledge or control of knowledge. Hopefully the new generation will migrate to the god with the most knowledge. Which would be the computer. The other problems is that god in religion is only about a quarter of the religion. It will be interesting to see what paths are taken by the computer generation.

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Posted: 03 November 2016 01:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 50 ]
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MikeYohe - 30 October 2016 08:43 PM

It is not really about atheist in the way we think about atheists. It is all about keeping control of the Saud power. Does that make rational sense to you?

The Saud family power is one factor in Saudi Arabia. But it is also a fact that in most Muslim-majority countries, Islam plays the most political power, including having Sharia laws, constitutional statements like ‘law could not go against Islam’, and blasphemy being punishable by death.

MikeYohe - 30 October 2016 09:10 PM
Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 30 October 2016 08:19 PM

Atrocities on Hindus by Muslim mobs in Bangladesh on October 30, 2016:

http://www.thedailystar.net/country/rampage-over-hindus-bbaria-1306723

An alleged Facebook post denigrating the Kaaba made these people crazy, and they attacked a community! (Kaaba is the symbol, located in Saudi Arabia, that Muslims all over the world face for praying.) Did the whole community denigrate the Kaaba? Surely not. Don’t these Islamic fanatics need to be humans and stop committing atrocities for their imbecilic feelings of loyalty/duty to their religion?

The key to the problem is knowledge. The fact that the people are viewing Facebook shows that they have the ability to learn from the computer. If you take the time to break down the gods to the root of their power. You will find that it is some form of knowledge or control of knowledge. Hopefully the new generation will migrate to the god with the most knowledge. Which would be the computer. The other problems is that god in religion is only about a quarter of the religion. It will be interesting to see what paths are taken by the computer generation.

Sorry, Mike, sometimes it is hard for me to understand what you wanted to say. But I do not think academic degrees, computer knowledge and use of the social media are adequate for getting people out of their religious brainwash. For example, when I was an undergraduate student in Bangladesh about 40 years back, there was hardly any burqa-clad or hijab-clad woman on the university campus; but now so many students and professors wear those Islamic garbs. Looks like those people are going backward in time in spite of their level of formal education.

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Posted: 03 November 2016 01:44 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 51 ]
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Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 03 November 2016 01:18 PM

Sorry, Mike, sometimes it is hard for me to understand what you wanted to say. But I do not think academic degrees, computer knowledge and use of the social media are adequate for getting people out of their religious brainwash. For example, when I was an undergraduate student in Bangladesh about 40 years back, there was hardly any burqa-clad or hijab-clad woman on the university campus; but now so many students and professors wear those Islamic garbs. Looks like those people are going backward in time in spite of their level of formal education.

I don’t get this argument, because you see some smart people acting like they care about Islamic traditions, that proves intelligence is not related to those traditions. That argument ignores the larger historical trend and focuses on a short term change of habits. It ignores other factors, like threats of losing your job, your family, or your life. It is only in recent history that we separated religion and politics, and it was done for political reasons. The separation is somewhat artificial at this stage. Religion is still politics, that is; it’s lifestyles, it’s culture. If you try to separate it like a physical trait, your data is going to be flawed.

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Posted: 04 November 2016 09:40 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 52 ]
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Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 03 November 2016 01:18 PM

Sorry, Mike, sometimes it is hard for me to understand what you wanted to say. But I do not think academic degrees, computer knowledge and use of the social media are adequate for getting people out of their religious brainwash. For example, when I was an undergraduate student in Bangladesh about 40 years back, there was hardly any burqa-clad or hijab-clad woman on the university campus; but now so many students and professors wear those Islamic garbs. Looks like those people are going backward in time in spite of their level of formal education.

You are right. I don’t have an answer to getting those people to change their minds. That is going to be a long and hard process. I was concerned about the new generation. If the new generation thinks differently than the older generation, then it may create an offset of some kind. This can only be done with a change in thinking. There is where the computer comes into play. The computer is very powerful, a lot of countries like China are putting controls on the computer now. 
 
I hear the same thing that you are talking about happening in Israel State. The beginning Jewish Israel state was European, the new Israel is picking up traditions and even creating traditions of religion. Sort of the more traditional you are - the more religious you are. Type of thinking. But there is a young group that is not going along with the change. And they are more the computer generation.
 
I think Lausten said it best. The fix will entail the separation of religion and politics. Which I don’t see happening anytime in the near future.

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Posted: 09 November 2016 07:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 53 ]
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MikeYohe - 04 November 2016 09:40 AM

The fix will entail the separation of religion and politics. Which I don’t see happening anytime in the near future.

Separation of religion from politics would require people to give up quite a bit of the religion, especially when that religion is Islam. I think the Muslims have more difficulty in rejecting aspects of what they think is their religion, most probably because most of them grow up seeing their parents, family and community too much into Islam, including praying five times a day every day.

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Posted: 09 November 2016 09:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 54 ]
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Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 03 November 2016 01:18 PM
MikeYohe - 30 October 2016 08:43 PM

It is not really about atheist in the way we think about atheists. It is all about keeping control of the Saud power. Does that make rational sense to you?

The Saud family power is one factor in Saudi Arabia. But it is also a fact that in most Muslim-majority countries, Islam plays the most political power, including having Sharia laws, constitutional statements like ‘law could not go against Islam’, and blasphemy being punishable by death.

MikeYohe - 30 October 2016 09:10 PM
Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 30 October 2016 08:19 PM

Atrocities on Hindus by Muslim mobs in Bangladesh on October 30, 2016:

http://www.thedailystar.net/country/rampage-over-hindus-bbaria-1306723

An alleged Facebook post denigrating the Kaaba made these people crazy, and they attacked a community! (Kaaba is the symbol, located in Saudi Arabia, that Muslims all over the world face for praying.) Did the whole community denigrate the Kaaba? Surely not. Don’t these Islamic fanatics need to be humans and stop committing atrocities for their imbecilic feelings of loyalty/duty to their religion?

The key to the problem is knowledge. The fact that the people are viewing Facebook shows that they have the ability to learn from the computer. If you take the time to break down the gods to the root of their power. You will find that it is some form of knowledge or control of knowledge. Hopefully the new generation will migrate to the god with the most knowledge. Which would be the computer. The other problems is that god in religion is only about a quarter of the religion. It will be interesting to see what paths are taken by the computer generation.

Sorry, Mike, sometimes it is hard for me to understand what you wanted to say. But I do not think academic degrees, computer knowledge and use of the social media are adequate for getting people out of their religious brainwash. For example, when I was an undergraduate student in Bangladesh about 40 years back, there was hardly any burqa-clad or hijab-clad woman on the university campus; but now so many students and professors wear those Islamic garbs. Looks like those people are going backward in time in spite of their level of formal education.

Were there any women at all on the university campus 40’years agp? It seems highly unlikely.

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Posted: 10 November 2016 09:48 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 55 ]
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Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 09 November 2016 07:25 PM
MikeYohe - 04 November 2016 09:40 AM

The fix will entail the separation of religion and politics. Which I don’t see happening anytime in the near future.

Separation of religion from politics would require people to give up quite a bit of the religion, especially when that religion is Islam. I think the Muslims have more difficulty in rejecting aspects of what they think is their religion, most probably because most of them grow up seeing their parents, family and community too much into Islam, including praying five times a day every day.

The solution is simple. If you want to end the problems with religion. Study religion in school. Don’t preach religion. Don’t teach religion. But study religion. And study religion from its beginning.

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Posted: 10 November 2016 11:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 56 ]
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MikeYohe - 10 November 2016 09:48 AM

...................If you want to end the problems with religion, study religion in school. Don’t preach religion. Don’t teach religion. But study religion. And study religion from its beginning.

I agree. In fact, I think if people applied their human intelligence while looking at religions, they would not need much help from others to dump the religions, especially the ones that involve prescriptions from some kind of an almighty. That should not take much time either. However, I would not encourage anyone to spend too much time on religions. People need to study science, technology and humanities a lot more for the advancement of the human civilization.

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Posted: 10 November 2016 11:34 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 57 ]
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MikeYohe - 10 November 2016 09:48 AM
Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 09 November 2016 07:25 PM
MikeYohe - 04 November 2016 09:40 AM

The fix will entail the separation of religion and politics. Which I don’t see happening anytime in the near future.

Separation of religion from politics would require people to give up quite a bit of the religion, especially when that religion is Islam. I think the Muslims have more difficulty in rejecting aspects of what they think is their religion, most probably because most of them grow up seeing their parents, family and community too much into Islam, including praying five times a day every day.

The solution is simple. If you want to end the problems with religion. Study religion in school. Don’t preach religion. Don’t teach religion. But study religion. And study religion from its beginning.

You are assuming that if people studied religion they would come to the same conclusions you did. Everyone with a seminary degree who still believes, all the politicians who must try to understand other religions but don’t, the people who become atheist through reason, then return to religion, all are evidence against that. Freaking St. Paul is evidence against, and Muhammad even more so.

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Posted: 10 November 2016 11:42 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 58 ]
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LoisL - 09 November 2016 09:41 PM
Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 03 November 2016 01:18 PM
MikeYohe - 30 October 2016 09:10 PM
Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 30 October 2016 08:19 PM

Atrocities on Hindus by Muslim mobs in Bangladesh on October 30, 2016:

http://www.thedailystar.net/country/rampage-over-hindus-bbaria-1306723

An alleged Facebook post denigrating the Kaaba made these people crazy, and they attacked a community! (Kaaba is the symbol, located in Saudi Arabia, that Muslims all over the world face for praying.) Did the whole community denigrate the Kaaba? Surely not. Don’t these Islamic fanatics need to be humans and stop committing atrocities for their imbecilic feelings of loyalty/duty to their religion?

The key to the problem is knowledge. The fact that the people are viewing Facebook shows that they have the ability to learn from the computer. If you take the time to break down the gods to the root of their power. You will find that it is some form of knowledge or control of knowledge. Hopefully the new generation will migrate to the god with the most knowledge. Which would be the computer. The other problems is that god in religion is only about a quarter of the religion. It will be interesting to see what paths are taken by the computer generation.

................ But I do not think academic degrees, computer knowledge and use of the social media are adequate for getting people out of their religious brainwash. For example, when I was an undergraduate student in Bangladesh about 40 years back, there was hardly any burqa-clad or hijab-clad woman on the university campus; but now so many students and professors wear those Islamic garbs. Looks like those people are going backward in time in spite of their level of formal education.

Were there any women at all on the university campus 40’years agp? It seems highly unlikely.

There actually were. In our Chemistry honors class of 40 students, there were 10 women; and none of them wore hijab or any other kind of excessive body covering. I believe the enrollment of women has gone up over the years.

[ Edited: 10 November 2016 12:13 PM by Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain ]
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Posted: 10 November 2016 05:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 59 ]
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Lausten - 10 November 2016 11:34 AM
MikeYohe - 10 November 2016 09:48 AM
Sukhamaya (Sam) Bain - 09 November 2016 07:25 PM
MikeYohe - 04 November 2016 09:40 AM

The fix will entail the separation of religion and politics. Which I don’t see happening anytime in the near future.

Separation of religion from politics would require people to give up quite a bit of the religion, especially when that religion is Islam. I think the Muslims have more difficulty in rejecting aspects of what they think is their religion, most probably because most of them grow up seeing their parents, family and community too much into Islam, including praying five times a day every day.

The solution is simple. If you want to end the problems with religion. Study religion in school. Don’t preach religion. Don’t teach religion. But study religion. And study religion from its beginning.

You are assuming that if people studied religion they would come to the same conclusions you did. Everyone with a seminary degree who still believes, all the politicians who must try to understand other religions but don’t, the people who become atheist through reason, then return to religion, all are evidence against that. Freaking St. Paul is evidence against, and Muhammad even more so.

You bring up some very good points. My feelings about this is that a couple of decades ago this solution would not have worked. But today there is so much data that has changed, added to the new data being discover and rethought of the past. Along with the new technologies that are available. That it should not be that hard of a task.
 
St. Paul is a bad example being a nontrinitarian and religion was a mystery to Paul. Then Muhammad created his own religion, sort of like what Paul did. I don’t think we have many people today the same as Paul and Muhammad. 

Knowledge for the most part is nothing more than comparison. But it seems when religion is the subject today, the comparison never takes place. Most people don’t even know the name of their god. Just how bad is that? The goal is not to change their mind at school. But to get them to understand that they can compare religion just like subjects of math, science and history. Then instead of just the disgruntled Christians looking for answers, everyone will know that is OK to look for answers.

[ Edited: 10 November 2016 05:21 PM by MikeYohe ]
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Posted: 18 November 2016 04:24 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 60 ]
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After This Jordanian Criticized ISIS, He Was Thrown In Jail, Then Murdered

http://thefederalist.com/2016/11/17/muslim-criticized-isis-thrown-jail-murdered/

Two paragraphs from this news article:

“It’s bad enough that the Jordanian government arrested Hattar, charged him, and was about to throw the book at him for sharing a cartoon on Facebook (a cartoon, remember, that jabs the Islamic State). What makes the story doubly chilling is that a sizeable number of people thought even jail was not enough.

Many threatened Hattar’s life, and one imam murdered him, presumably because he deemed the Jordanian regime insufficiently pious to hand down a punishment fitting Hattar’s crime. Days later, an Egyptian TV commentator went on the air to declare his support—not for Hattar, but for his executioner. The blasphemer had it coming.”

Is’t it sad that many Westerners think that the Islamic fanaticism problem of the Middle East was a creation of the West?

(For people who do not know, an “Imam” is the person who leads prayers in the Islamic house of worship called mosque.}

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