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Why study philosophy?
Posted: 08 January 2017 05:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 04:50 PM
Lausten - 08 January 2017 04:15 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 03:33 PM
Lausten - 08 January 2017 12:33 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 12:13 PM

But it never does lead anywhere because it ultimately cannot be prove .

Troll

No, fact: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Münchhausen_trilemma

They cannot prove anything, all they have is “because I say so” (which is what I boils down to). They cannot prove any of their claims and so are unable to give truth.

Exactly. I showed you that months ago

So that proves how useless the field is if there can be no foundation for any of its claims.

How does it prove that? Show your work.

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Posted: 08 January 2017 06:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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The field is supposed to search for truth and wisdom. But the trilema states that one requires proof for its proof and this goes all the way back to the point where you must accept one of theee unsatisfactory points. The acceptance of each of any of these points means that there is no solid foundation for any truth you claim to seek. Each bit of information is just as valid as any other. Without any actual solid support underneath it you are building a house of sand. The field relies on asking why the entire time in order to find truth but if you question it enough that it eventually just comes down to belief and how can you prove any belief wrong?

That’s why philosophy is just a dog chasing its tail, even if it could attempt an answer it couldn’t prove it. Not that it even answers any of the questions it posits, I have to think that people are delusional if they think it helps them to understand the world

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Posted: 08 January 2017 06:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 06:05 PM

The field is supposed to search for truth and wisdom. But the trilema states that one requires proof for its proof and this goes all the way back to the point where you must accept one of theee unsatisfactory points. The acceptance of each of any of these points means that there is no solid foundation for any truth you claim to seek. Each bit of information is just as valid as any other. Without any actual solid support underneath it you are building a house of sand. The field relies on asking why the entire time in order to find truth but if you question it enough that it eventually just comes down to belief and how can you prove any belief wrong?

That’s why philosophy is just a dog chasing its tail, even if it could attempt an answer it couldn’t prove it. Not that it even answers any of the questions it posits, I have to think that people are delusional if they think it helps them to understand the world

And, lookey there, you’re doing philosophy. Well done grasshopper. When you can walk across the rice paper without tearing it, it will be time for you to go.

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Posted: 08 January 2017 07:46 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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Lausten - 08 January 2017 06:56 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 06:05 PM

The field is supposed to search for truth and wisdom. But the trilema states that one requires proof for its proof and this goes all the way back to the point where you must accept one of theee unsatisfactory points. The acceptance of each of any of these points means that there is no solid foundation for any truth you claim to seek. Each bit of information is just as valid as any other. Without any actual solid support underneath it you are building a house of sand. The field relies on asking why the entire time in order to find truth but if you question it enough that it eventually just comes down to belief and how can you prove any belief wrong?

That’s why philosophy is just a dog chasing its tail, even if it could attempt an answer it couldn’t prove it. Not that it even answers any of the questions it posits, I have to think that people are delusional if they think it helps them to understand the world

And, lookey there, you’re doing philosophy. Well done grasshopper. When you can walk across the rice paper without tearing it, it will be time for you to go.

That doesn’t prove it’s useful, I ironically used it to prove how pointless and stupid it is.

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 07:46 PM
Lausten - 08 January 2017 06:56 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 06:05 PM

The field is supposed to search for truth and wisdom. But the trilema states that one requires proof for its proof and this goes all the way back to the point where you must accept one of theee unsatisfactory points. The acceptance of each of any of these points means that there is no solid foundation for any truth you claim to seek. Each bit of information is just as valid as any other. Without any actual solid support underneath it you are building a house of sand. The field relies on asking why the entire time in order to find truth but if you question it enough that it eventually just comes down to belief and how can you prove any belief wrong?

That’s why philosophy is just a dog chasing its tail, even if it could attempt an answer it couldn’t prove it. Not that it even answers any of the questions it posits, I have to think that people are delusional if they think it helps them to understand the world

And, lookey there, you’re doing philosophy. Well done grasshopper. When you can walk across the rice paper without tearing it, it will be time for you to go.

That doesn’t prove it’s useful, I ironically used it to prove how pointless and stupid it is.

Eh, very philosophical

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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Titanomachina - 07 January 2017 09:47 PM

I ask this because it doesn’t seem to lead anywhere.

I get that philosophy is the study of knowledge, existence, reality, and all that good stuff. But what I don’t get is the point or the end game, since it seems like just about anything in it can be debated and still end up right. It’s very vague and arbitrary and much of it is based on how you define things. But for a field that pursues knowledge and wisdom they seem to give very little if any of what they claim to seek. All it seems to do is make you ask questions and doubt your knowledge and beliefs, but doesn’t give anything to replace that. It takes and takes but gives nothing back.

Like in the case of solipsism it introduces the possibility that you might be the only thing that exists and that anything outside of you is not possible to verify that it exists. It makes you doubt what is real to the point that those who buy into it usually are unable to leave it. But it doesn’t provide any way to solve the question it poses (like much of philosophy). The same goes for idealism, another idea that it can’t prove. So why bother if it gets nowhere?

Its primarily a mental exercise for those without jobs.

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:29 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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But it just means that its a waste of time. I didn’t get anywhere, I said the same thing I did before but with more words. There was no difference between the two. You saying such things does not make a case for philosophy being something useful. You just further show how pointless it all is.

Like I said already, what good is thinking that doesn’t go anywhere?

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 08:29 PM

But it just means that its a waste of time. I didn’t get anywhere, I said the same thing I did before but with more words. There was no difference between the two. You saying such things does not make a case for philosophy being something useful. You just further show how pointless it all is.

Like I said already, what good is thinking that doesn’t go anywhere?

Saying things with more words is exactly what philosophers do. I had no intention of proving anything had a point or is useful.

Your question is a philosophical question.

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 08:29 PM

But it just means that its a waste of time. I didn’t get anywhere, I said the same thing I did before but with more words. There was no difference between the two. You saying such things does not make a case for philosophy being something useful. You just further show how pointless it all is.

Like I said already, what good is thinking that doesn’t go anywhere?

It is a waste of time for most people. To be fair, philosophy does have some fundamental use in science because it can assist in forming logically coherent theories, concepts, etc. Aside from that there is no practical use for it.

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:48 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 12:21 PM
JSmith - 08 January 2017 12:04 PM

The five main areas of philosophy…

That doesn’t tell me anything or even address what I’m saying. You say philosophy is a tool for understanding yet it just leaves a great deal of unanswered questions that we simply cannot find the answers for. It also cannot prove the existence of other humans or yourself, the existence of a god, or even that of an external reality. Morality is also just as up for debate but eventually comes down to popular vote. What I’m trying (and keep saying) is that for a field that tries to understand the world it does nothing of the sort. For a field that seeks answers to questions, it cannot provide any. All philosophy, if questioned enough, comes down to proof that it cannot provide (which is why some thinkers had to use god otherwise they would never get anywhere).

There is always a “why” to ask for everything and those whys don’t go anywhere. They say philosophy makes progress by to me it seems like it is just stuck from the same place it started.

And I’ll state again, what’s the use of thinking that doesn’t go anywhere (or can’t for that matter)?

Philosophy is a process for logical thought and reasoning. Processes are not themselves thinking but for processing thinking. Thinking is energy flowing through the human brain and is controllable to a great extent by each person. Thus philosophy was developed by other individual humans for their own benefit and the benefit of someone like yourself and all others. If an idea forms in your head somehow, philosophy provides a set of steps to help you process that idea. Philosophy can’t know anything. Only individuals know things as far as we “know”.  So if you pose a question, the steps of philosophy will help guide you to do what is known as critical thinking. By doing the work of thinking you can use philosophy to make thinking more helpful as you seek answers for yourself, and if you’re good at thinking, others may listen to you kindly as well.

I’ve outlined the five steps.
But you have to think yourself.
Thinking is work.
There are few shortcuts.

Get to work but watch out…religion has ruined most of the moral philosophical literature by saying Holy Moley is real when, given the best science, Holy Moley is just that…Holey and Moley.
Stick to scientific philosophy based on skeptical realism.
Skeptical realism posits that the world is real and can be known. Over 80% of professional philosophers base their work on skeptical realism.

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:48 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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Lausten - 08 January 2017 08:34 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 08:29 PM

But it just means that its a waste of time. I didn’t get anywhere, I said the same thing I did before but with more words. There was no difference between the two. You saying such things does not make a case for philosophy being something useful. You just further show how pointless it all is.

Like I said already, what good is thinking that doesn’t go anywhere?

Saying things with more words is exactly what philosophers do. I had no intention of proving anything had a point or is useful.

Your question is a philosophical question.

That doesn’t answer my question, also no it’s not

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 08:48 PM
Lausten - 08 January 2017 08:34 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 08:29 PM

But it just means that its a waste of time. I didn’t get anywhere, I said the same thing I did before but with more words. There was no difference between the two. You saying such things does not make a case for philosophy being something useful. You just further show how pointless it all is.

Like I said already, what good is thinking that doesn’t go anywhere?

Saying things with more words is exactly what philosophers do. I had no intention of proving anything had a point or is useful.

Your question is a philosophical question.

That doesn’t answer my question, also no it’s not

There is no answer to your question, that’s why it’s philosophical!

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
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JSmith - 08 January 2017 08:48 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 12:21 PM
JSmith - 08 January 2017 12:04 PM

The five main areas of philosophy…

That doesn’t tell me anything or even address what I’m saying. You say philosophy is a tool for understanding yet it just leaves a great deal of unanswered questions that we simply cannot find the answers for. It also cannot prove the existence of other humans or yourself, the existence of a god, or even that of an external reality. Morality is also just as up for debate but eventually comes down to popular vote. What I’m trying (and keep saying) is that for a field that tries to understand the world it does nothing of the sort. For a field that seeks answers to questions, it cannot provide any. All philosophy, if questioned enough, comes down to proof that it cannot provide (which is why some thinkers had to use god otherwise they would never get anywhere).

There is always a “why” to ask for everything and those whys don’t go anywhere. They say philosophy makes progress by to me it seems like it is just stuck from the same place it started.

And I’ll state again, what’s the use of thinking that doesn’t go anywhere (or can’t for that matter)?

Philosophy is a process for logical thought and reasoning. Processes are not themselves thinking but for processing thinking. Thinking is energy flowing through the human brain and is controllable to a great extent by each person. Thus philosophy was developed by other individual humans for their own benefit and the benefit of someone like yourself and all others. If an idea forms in your head somehow, philosophy provides a set of steps to help you process that idea. Philosophy can’t know anything. Only individuals know things as far as we “know”.  So if you pose a question, the steps of philosophy will help guide you to do what is known as critical thinking. By doing the work of thinking you can use philosophy to make thinking more helpful as you seek answers for yourself, and if you’re good at thinking, others may listen to you kindly as well.

I’ve outlined the five steps.
But you have to think yourself.
Thinking is work.
There are few shortcuts.

Get to work but watch out…religion has ruined most of the moral philosophical literature by saying Holy Moley is real when, given the best science, Holy Moley is just that…Holey and Moley.
Stick to scientific philosophy based on skeptical realism.
Skeptical realism posits that the world is real and can be known. Over 80% of professional philosophers base their work on skeptical realism.

You have said nothing of import that addresses my question. I just told you that philosophy doesn’t give answers just questions. Philosophy just mostly tosses the idea in the brain without getting anywhere to solve it. Is like some tool created just to give the illusion of intelligence and though while ultimately accomplishing nothing. It doesn’t aid thinking or understanding, it just paralyzes thought.

Thinking in philosophy is like being on a treadmill. Also prove that thinking is energy flowing through the brain (we don’t even know what thoughts are).

You also realize that skeptical realism is a belief and can’t be proven?

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Posted: 08 January 2017 08:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
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Lausten - 08 January 2017 08:52 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 08:48 PM
Lausten - 08 January 2017 08:34 PM
Titanomachina - 08 January 2017 08:29 PM

But it just means that its a waste of time. I didn’t get anywhere, I said the same thing I did before but with more words. There was no difference between the two. You saying such things does not make a case for philosophy being something useful. You just further show how pointless it all is.

Like I said already, what good is thinking that doesn’t go anywhere?

Saying things with more words is exactly what philosophers do. I had no intention of proving anything had a point or is useful.

Your question is a philosophical question.

That doesn’t answer my question, also no it’s not

There is no answer to your question, that’s why it’s philosophical!

No there is an answer, it’s either useful or not. You just can give one because you are stuck with uselsss tools.

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Posted: 08 January 2017 09:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
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Beltane - 08 January 2017 08:26 PM
Titanomachina - 07 January 2017 09:47 PM

I ask this because it doesn’t seem to lead anywhere.

I get that philosophy is the study of knowledge, existence, reality, and all that good stuff. But what I don’t get is the point or the end game, since it seems like just about anything in it can be debated and still end up right. It’s very vague and arbitrary and much of it is based on how you define things. But for a field that pursues knowledge and wisdom they seem to give very little if any of what they claim to seek. All it seems to do is make you ask questions and doubt your knowledge and beliefs, but doesn’t give anything to replace that. It takes and takes but gives nothing back.

Like in the case of solipsism it introduces the possibility that you might be the only thing that exists and that anything outside of you is not possible to verify that it exists. It makes you doubt what is real to the point that those who buy into it usually are unable to leave it. But it doesn’t provide any way to solve the question it poses (like much of philosophy). The same goes for idealism, another idea that it can’t prove. So why bother if it gets nowhere?

Its primarily a mental exercise for those without jobs.

Speak for yourself.

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