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Goldwater Institute wants to legitimize hate speech.
Posted: 15 May 2017 04:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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Beltane - 14 May 2017 10:15 PM
Citizenschallenge-v.3 - 13 May 2017 06:55 PM
Beltane - 13 May 2017 03:32 PM

The term “hate speech” gets thrown around too often as a way to shut down those one doesn’t like.

Guess for an amoral people the sky’s the limit Beltane.

What is it about deliberately using fabricated lies to slandering and libel professionals that you don’t like - that isn’t hateful?

What is it about vicious and malicious that isn’t hateful?

No, lying isn’t hate speech, maybe it’s hateful to lie sometimes but doesn’t make it hate speech, legally.

And what are you taking about? Who is Coulter slandering? Which professionals?

Seriously? If you are going to discuss Coulter, there is an expectation that you have listened to her once or twice.
Do you have some reasoned discourse from her that you can site?

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Posted: 15 May 2017 12:14 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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deros - 10 May 2017 04:02 PM

Free speech means just what the words say.  There are limits but damn few.  On another “freedom issue”, there prayer in school each day. There is no way in heaven or hell it can be stopped.  Don’t believe me, check with the algebra class.

The right to free speech does not include speeches that are paid for. When payment and the use of facilities is involved—even government-owned facilities, it is no longer a matter of free speech. Using Government owned facilities to give a speech does not come under the heading of free speech. As I said before, the right to free speech is limited to the public square. No one has an automatic right to speak in any other place under the intent of the first amendment. A disturbingly large percentage of the US citizenry misinterprets the right to free speech. It doesn’t mean what many people seem to think it means—that citizens have a right to express any opinion in any location other than the public square.

Lois

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Posted: 15 May 2017 01:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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Lausten - 15 May 2017 04:49 AM

Do you have some reasoned discourse from her that you can site?

That was going to be my next question.
Now I’m curious to see what B comes up with.  smirk

Incidentally, Lois makes another key point that the frothing alt-right consistently chooses to ignore.

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Posted: 15 May 2017 08:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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Lausten - 15 May 2017 04:49 AM
Beltane - 14 May 2017 10:15 PM
Citizenschallenge-v.3 - 13 May 2017 06:55 PM
Beltane - 13 May 2017 03:32 PM

The term “hate speech” gets thrown around too often as a way to shut down those one doesn’t like.

Guess for an amoral people the sky’s the limit Beltane.

What is it about deliberately using fabricated lies to slandering and libel professionals that you don’t like - that isn’t hateful?

What is it about vicious and malicious that isn’t hateful?

No, lying isn’t hate speech, maybe it’s hateful to lie sometimes but doesn’t make it hate speech, legally.

And what are you taking about? Who is Coulter slandering? Which professionals?

Seriously? If you are going to discuss Coulter, there is an expectation that you have listened to her once or twice.
Do you have some reasoned discourse from her that you can site?

Whether her discourse is reasoned or unreasoned is irrelevant because neither constitutes hate speech.

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Posted: 16 May 2017 04:36 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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Beltane - 15 May 2017 08:58 PM
Lausten - 15 May 2017 04:49 AM

Seriously? If you are going to discuss Coulter, there is an expectation that you have listened to her once or twice.
Do you have some reasoned discourse from her that you can site?

Whether her discourse is reasoned or unreasoned is irrelevant because neither constitutes hate speech.

Okay, do you have some non-hate examples from her?

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Posted: 16 May 2017 07:01 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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Lausten - 16 May 2017 04:36 AM
Beltane - 15 May 2017 08:58 PM
Lausten - 15 May 2017 04:49 AM

Seriously? If you are going to discuss Coulter, there is an expectation that you have listened to her once or twice.
Do you have some reasoned discourse from her that you can site?

Whether her discourse is reasoned or unreasoned is irrelevant because neither constitutes hate speech.

Okay, do you have some non-hate examples from her?

Reread my comment.

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Posted: 16 May 2017 07:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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What comment?  That anything goes?

Citizenschallenge-v.3 - 13 May 2017 06:55 PM
Beltane - 13 May 2017 03:32 PM

The term “hate speech” gets thrown around too often as a way to shut down those one doesn’t like.

Guess for an amoral people the sky’s the limit Beltane.

What is it about deliberately using fabricated lies to slandering and libel professionals that you don’t like - that isn’t hateful?

What is it about vicious and malicious that isn’t hateful?

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Posted: 16 May 2017 07:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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Beltane - 16 May 2017 07:01 AM
Lausten - 16 May 2017 04:36 AM
Beltane - 15 May 2017 08:58 PM
Lausten - 15 May 2017 04:49 AM

Seriously? If you are going to discuss Coulter, there is an expectation that you have listened to her once or twice.
Do you have some reasoned discourse from her that you can site?

Whether her discourse is reasoned or unreasoned is irrelevant because neither constitutes hate speech.

Okay, do you have some non-hate examples from her?

Reread my comment.

The one where you got nuthin?

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Posted: 16 May 2017 06:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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Lausten - 16 May 2017 07:49 AM
Beltane - 16 May 2017 07:01 AM
Lausten - 16 May 2017 04:36 AM
Beltane - 15 May 2017 08:58 PM
Lausten - 15 May 2017 04:49 AM

Seriously? If you are going to discuss Coulter, there is an expectation that you have listened to her once or twice.
Do you have some reasoned discourse from her that you can site?

Whether her discourse is reasoned or unreasoned is irrelevant because neither constitutes hate speech.

Okay, do you have some non-hate examples from her?

Reread my comment.

The one where you got nuthin?

Nothing that constitutes hate speech.

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Posted: 16 May 2017 07:16 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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Citizenschallengev3 and Lausten - both of you put down your bongs and try to understand this very simple thing: there is a such thing as hate speech in America, I can’t link to the definition but it’s easy to find.

Nothing Coulter says legally qualifies as hate speech. Her sarcastic insults and scientifically wrong ideas about global warming won’t make it to the courtroom. They’ll just piss off the over-sensitive - who wish she’d get arrested for wrongthink.

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Posted: 16 May 2017 08:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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deros - 10 May 2017 04:02 PM

Free speech means just what the words say.  There are limits but damn few.  On another “freedom issue”, there prayer in school each day. There is no way in heaven or hell it can be stopped.  Don’t believe me, check with the algebra class.

Schools creating times for spoken preayers has been stopped. Teachers leading prayers in schools has been stopped. Students can pray to themselves but can’t disrupt classes. Students can create their own prayer grouos on school playgrounds and sometimes inside the schools in certain areas, the point is that adukts may not lead it and students of other faiths may not be made to opt out. They can opt in, however. In most schools public prayer has not been encouraged.

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Posted: 16 May 2017 09:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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Hate speech is speech which attacks a person or group on the basis of attributes such as race, religion, ethnic origin, sexual orientation, disability, or gender. In the law of some countries, hate speech is described as speech, gesture or conduct, writing, or display which is forbidden because it incites violence or prejudicial action against or by a protected group, or individual on the basis of their membership to the group, or because it disparages or intimidates a protected group, or individual on the basis of their membership to the group. The law may identify a protected group by certain characteristics. In the law of other countries, hate speech is not a legal term. In some countries, a victim of hate speech may seek redress under civil law, criminal law, or both. A website which uses hate speech may be called a hate site. Most of these sites contain Internet forums and news briefs that emphasize a particular viewpoint.

There has been debate over freedom of speech, hate speech and hate speech legislation.  Critics have argued that the term “hate speech” is used to silence critics of social policies that have been poorly implemented.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech

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Posted: 17 May 2017 04:42 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
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Beltane - 16 May 2017 07:16 PM

Citizenschallengev3 and Lausten - both of you put down your bongs and try to understand this very simple thing: there is a such thing as hate speech in America, I can’t link to the definition but it’s easy to find.

Nothing Coulter says legally qualifies as hate speech. Her sarcastic insults and scientifically wrong ideas about global warming won’t make it to the courtroom. They’ll just piss off the over-sensitive - who wish she’d get arrested for wrongthink.

If you want to set the bar at the legal definition, fine by me.  I can still didmiss her and call her hateful.

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Posted: 17 May 2017 07:20 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
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Interesting the best you can come up with is a diversionary comic routine.  Intellectually bankrupt is as bankrupt does.

The gratuitous nasty diversion when you can’t handle the question.

Beltane - 16 May 2017 07:16 PM

Citizenschallengev3 and Lausten - both of you put down your bongs and ...

Might I be allowed to suggest that, you extract your head out of Rupert Murdoch’s asshole and start looking at the real world out here.
Okay, we’re even now.  Shall we refocus and see if Beltane is capable of a thoughtful response?

What is it about deliberately using fabricated lies to slandering and libel professionals that you don’t like - that isn’t hateful?

What is it about vicious and malicious that isn’t hateful?

I don’t know if your career consists of punching holes at an assembly line so that nothing else really matters,
but lets imagine you spent your life in diligent study and effort and you put together a respected professional career of significance, such Drs. Santer, Mann, Trenberth, etc.

Imagine yourself studying and discovering matters of the most serious existential important to our society.
If then some profits obsessed poddy-brains who hate intellectuals and hate the information you are discovering about specific aspects of how our natural system is reacting to what we are doing to it
- matters that are of extreme importance considering how much our society depends on our weather patterns for its sustenance -
if then malicious interests started fabricating total lies focused on destroying your hard earned excellent reputation and trashing your work based on ignoring and fabricating total bull-shit intend to do maximum harm your well-earned good reputation.  I wonder how you would feel?
I imagine you’d have a different perspective on hate-speech.

But, tragically seems to me the absolutist self-obsessed alt-reality folks behave as if they are as totally devoid of empathy or respect for others, as they are of morality and ethics.  All you see is humor in others getting dishonestly and maliciously trashed.

Perhaps an apt analogy to trying to get people like you to recognize hate-speech -  is like trying to explain water to a fish.

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Posted: 17 May 2017 09:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
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Further considerations

Beltane - 16 May 2017 07:16 PM

Nothing Coulter says legally qualifies as hate speech. Her sarcastic insults and scientifically wrong ideas about global warming won’t make it to the courtroom. They’ll just piss off the over-sensitive - who wish she’d get arrested for wrongthink.

Notice a complete disregard for the target, the human being at the receiving end.
it’s all good fun a’la Morano - trashing people’s good reputations, fuk ‘em if they can’t take a little heat, the over-sensitive infidels, I’ve got my mission to win, says the wiseguy.

What is it about deliberately using fabricated lies to slandering and libel professionals that you don’t like - that isn’t hateful?
What is it about vicious and malicious that isn’t hateful?

I am a child of the Intellectual Enlightenment, I believe in experiencing my life, observing and learning about the incredibly amazing (and worth understanding to the best of one’s ability) Creation surrounding us.

I also love community and being an engaged member of one, it’s cool cooperating with people based on recognizing our mutual humanity, not our dogmas.
I believe in respecting those who have earned respect. 
I believe in learning from the efforts of others who have toiled long and hard during their lives to add their little bit of learning to this ongoing centuries old humanistic project of communal understanding that Science and the Enlightenment is.

I believe in the basic honesty of people, especially when others are invited and expected to look over each others shoulders - as is the scientific way.  360° skepticism, genuine desire to learn and better understand, ...  a mob of artfully manipulated people is a whole other story.  (We need each other to keep ourselves honest!)

The Goldwater Institute, Beltane, Limbaugh seem to hate that sort of constructive fact based learning process, nope instead they have an agenda, a dogma with enemies to annihilate and a desire to win at all costs, the very definition of amoral. 

In earlier days the first global corporation had the power to deal with contrary personalities by invoking the Inquisition - apply a little pressure where it hurts, the old art of persuasion.  Can’t get away with that these days.  Now, it’s character assassination, derision and derailing every effort at serious, fact-based, constructive learning and trouble-shooting and decision making.  Nope, instead the alt-right heroes are slippery tongued serpents who demolish reputations with slick funny, wrongthink. But don’t call it hate-speech for all it’s hateful nature and intent

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