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A Haunting, Discovery channel series.
Posted: 07 June 2007 08:34 PM   [ Ignore ]
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What do you think about the show? If you’ve ever seen it? On the discovery channel page they even go so far as to say the stories are true.

Now I wouldn’t really care but I live in a family with a mother that’s deeply christain… and into wiccan things at the same time. So she’s all into and apparently even speaks to spirits that tell her stuff such as the ouji board is evil.

So whenever this show comes on she’ll say it’s on the discovery channel so obviously there’s an afterlife with other dimensions etc.

It’s really bothersum to have to live here.

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Posted: 07 June 2007 09:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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Many of us have similar histories.  When I was a teen-ager my mother got into astrology.  I tried to point out how silly it was, to no avail.  So, I began to read her library of astrology books (geez, why couldn’t I have been as assiduous with my school work?) until I was quite expert and much more familiar with the various facets than she was.  I did a great job of showing that either a) there was no correlation between the predictions and reality, b) the predictions were so vague that they could apply to anything, or c) that there were multiple sets of predictions which disagreed with each other. 

My arguments were unassailable and quite logical.  Their effect on my mother’s belief?  Zero. 

Later I realized she wasn’t looking for proof or disproof.  She just liked the feeling of thinking she knew what was happening. 

I also learned that, as much as I love and depend on logic, it’s just not that important or meaningful to a great many people.

I sympathize with you.  Hang in there.

Occam

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Posted: 07 June 2007 10:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Hmm… thanks for the reply. Was looking for someone who understood what I was saying. Although it’s not just her but the entire family as well, so you may imagine the criticism I face.

I guess I let my personal issues get in way of the issue I was actually attempting to bring up which is the vailidity of the show A Haunting on the Discovery Channel and them portraying it as, true. I’m open to new ideas but whenever anything paranormal happens there’s never anything to it other than someone’s first hand account and a story.

One one think if there was any credibility to such subjects that exorcisms and preventing demons from getting into your home may be a concern of the government. So while I think it’s all basically crap, I’m still open to it being possible despite seeing it as improbable. Mmm… am I getting off track here?

Suppose I’ll end it here then… still sick with a resporitory infection so that can’t be helping…

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Posted: 08 June 2007 10:30 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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Verdius - 07 June 2007 10:45 PM

I guess I let my personal issues get in way of the issue I was actually attempting to bring up which is the vailidity of the show…

Well, any program that has to reconstruct hauntings using actors has a credibility problem from the very start, as far as I’m concerned.  I tried watching it with an open mind once or twice, but changed the channel when I realized that there was no way to tell how much was fact and how much was fiction (like the “Psychic Detectives” show).  It’s basically a televised campfire ghost story.  You’ve got to remember that most people WANT to believe in an afterlife.

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Posted: 08 June 2007 08:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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All one has to do is watch a Harry Potter movie to see the wonderful special effects they can conjure so a film is totally meaningless as proof of the paranormal.  Similarly, all one has to do is watch a good magician and absolutely know what s/he’s doing isn’t supernatural, even though it seems that there’s no possible way for him/her to accomplish it by standard physical means.  I’m sure Doug can tell you about the Skeptics as part of the Humanists.  I’m so disinterested in any of this stuff that I never bother even reading how they debunk these myths, so I can’t point you toward sources.

Occam

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Posted: 09 June 2007 04:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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These shows truly drive me crazy.  I don’t know if I’ve seen the one you are talking about in particular, but the ghost hunter programs are so completely bogus.  What really bothers me is that they claim they are skeptics who don’t believe in ghosts, and then every episode they are all like, “WHAT WAS THAT!  I HEARD A NOISE!!!” or “LOOK AT THAT FLOATING APPARITION” and the video camera swings around and… just misses it.  Somebody please tell me these people have been debunked because it’s so reeeetarded.

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Posted: 10 June 2007 11:38 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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Ugh… if I make it through my time on Earth before being driven insane by these shows, it will be a miracle of biblical proportions… And I don’t believe in miracles or the bible so that narrows the odds a little bit.

But on the Discovery Channel?

I used to love that channel because it was scientific! But now…

I love it on other ghost shows when they have a psychic, and whenever the psychic has a strange feeling that’s used as evidence… And of course, the psychic couldn’t possibly be making it up! And psychics can’t possibly not exist!

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1. God is omnipotent.
Source: Several incidents where I’ve annoyed fundamentalist Christians by challenging God’s power.
2. If God is omnipotent then he can travel faster than the speed of light.
Modus Ponens
3. Nothing can travel faster than the speed of light.
Source: Einstein
Therefore, God is nothing.
QED

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Posted: 01 July 2007 08:00 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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Does evil exist?

The university professor challenged his students with this question. Did God create everything that exists? A student bravely replied, “Yes, he did!”

“God created everything? The professor asked.

“Yes sir”, the student replied.

The professor answered, “If God created everything, then God created evil since evil exists, and according to the principal that our works define who we are then God is evil”. The student became quiet before such an answer. The professor was quite pleased with himself and boasted to the students that he had proven once more that the Christian faith was a myth.

Another student raised his hand and said, “Can I ask you a question professor?”

“Of course”, replied the professor.

The student stood up and asked, “Professor, does cold exist?”

“What kind of question is this? Of course it exists. Have you never been cold?” The students snickered at the young man’s question.

The young man replied, “In fact sir, cold does not exist. According to the laws of physics, what we consider cold is in reality the absence of heat. Every body or object is susceptible to study when it has or transmits energy, and heat is what makes a body or matter have or transmit energy. Absolute zero (-460 degrees F) is the total absence of heat; all matter becomes inert and incapable of reaction at that temperature. Cold does not exist. We have created this word to describe how we feel if we have no heat.”

The student continued, “Professor, does darkness exist?”

The professor responded, “Of course it does.”

The student replied, “Once again you are wrong sir, darkness does not exist either. Darkness is in reality the absence of light. Light we can study, but not darkness. In fact we can use Newton’s prism to break white light into many colors and study the various wavelengths of each color. You cannot measure darkness. A simple ray of light can break into a world of darkness and illuminate it. How can you know how dark a certain space is? You measure the amount of light present. Isn’t this correct? Darkness is a term used by man to describe what happens when there is no light present.”

Finally the young man asked the professor, “Sir, does evil exist?”

Now uncertain, the professor responded, “Of course as I have already said. We see it every day. It is in the daily example of man’s inhumanity to man. It is in the multitude of crime and violence everywhere in the world. These manifestations are nothing else but evil.”

To this the student replied, “Evil does not exist sir, or at least it does not exist unto itself. Evil is simply the absence of God. It is just like darkness and cold, a word that man has created to describe the absence of God. God did not create evil. Evil is not like faith, or love that exist just as does light and heat. Evil is the result of what happens when man does not have God’s love present in his heart. It’s like the cold that comes when there is no heat or the darkness that comes when there is no light.”

The professor sat down.

The young man’s name — Albert Einstein.

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Posted: 02 July 2007 07:42 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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This quote is not by Albert Einstein.  Do some research before you enter into Discovery Channel Haunting discussions with parables about noted physicists debating the merits of God.

http://www.snopes.com/religion/einstein.asp

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Posted: 02 July 2007 10:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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ticktock - 09 June 2007 04:19 PM

Somebody please tell me these people have been debunked because it’s so reeeetarded.

The thing I like about Ghost Hunters is that you see exactly what they do.  As you say, sometimes one or two will CLAIM they saw a full-torso vaporous apparition, but if they don’t get it on tape, that’s too bad.  They don’t attempt to re-enact it.  You have the bare claim and nothing else, and you can base your judgment on that.

If all they catch on tape is a vague shadow flitting across the screen, once again, you have the same evidence they did.  They can assume it was one of the “shadow people” if they like, but you have the same information they have.  I have watched Ghost Hunters with my 81 year old mother, who does not have the slightest bit of training in science or in skeptical thinking.  But on the other hand, she’s 81 years old.  She’ll say, “Looks like a candlefly to me.”  smile

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Posted: 02 July 2007 12:45 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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ticktock - 02 July 2007 07:42 AM

This quote is not by Albert Einstein.  Do some research before you enter into Discovery Channel Haunting discussions with parables about noted physicists debating the merits of God.

http://www.snopes.com/religion/einstein.asp


So there! ‘-)

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Posted: 02 July 2007 09:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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Not only is it not by Einstein, the whole parable is a study in critical thinking fallacies - Strawman arguments, unsound analogies, etc.  This it the kind of stupid story a minister tells to his confused congregation because they are not educated enough or self-reliant enough to think it through or to think for themselves.

Occam

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Posted: 02 July 2007 10:41 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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And there for the grace of God goes you.

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Posted: 03 July 2007 11:59 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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And there for the grace of God goes you.

Isn’t it wierd how someone can say something like this and then sit back smugly as if they’ve said something profound, compassionate, or even meaningful? Only the grace of God (or perhaps profound self-delusion?) could make something so vapid seem like something deep and useful.

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Posted: 19 November 2007 11:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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interestingly enough, I live in Bangladesh—and the quote is making the rounds here as having ostensibly been an incident in Dr APJ Abdul Kalam’s life—he is India’s preeminent rocket scientist and Ex-President.

I used to hear similar stories when I was a teen from my Chem/Phys Profs who would describe the same event as having occurred to Einstein/Socrates !

Is there a myth making machine which exists to spin out these apocryphal stories ?

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Posted: 19 November 2007 12:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]
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Lily - 01 July 2007 08:00 PM

The student stood up and asked, “Professor, does cold exist?”  The student continued, “Professor, does darkness exist?”
The professor sat down.
The young man’s name — Albert Einstein.

I’ve had that email forwarded to me a couple times.  That story successfully defines God the same way that Santa Clause was defined in the famous Letter “Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Clause” by Francis Pharcellus Church.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yes,_Virginia,_there_is_a_Santa_Claus

Lily, are you a Santa Clause atheist? ohh

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