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Invasion USA
Posted: 07 November 2007 10:17 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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skepticdave - 07 November 2007 09:02 PM

What part of “ILLEGAL” don’t we understand?

If you don’t like the law…...........change it…......until then…

If your quote here was addressed to me, then I think you missed my point.  I am also against the “illegal” aspect.

As I said before, stop crooked Americans from undercutting wage and benefit laws and the whole of the illegal immigrant problem will vanish in a jiff.  That means stop “illegal” American business practices.  How many “illegal” immigrants do you really think would find work in America if businesses had to pay them minimum wage plus benefits?  Going after immigrants who are looking for a better life is about as brilliant as going after heroin addicts without concern for the dealer.

Of course, we do need to make all immigration “legal” and document it.  Prohibition wasn’t good law either.  So much so that it was unreasonable to expect people to follow it.

skepticdave - 07 November 2007 09:02 PM

I’m not anti-immigration mind you, just anti-illegal immigration.

Your tone makes me skeptical.  Along those lines, you don’t sound much like the guy in your picture.

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Posted: 08 November 2007 04:32 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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It’s pretty futile to discuss with any of you the facts of illegal immigration such as U.S. Law.  If you don’t understand the basic concepts of the American Legal system, the mandates set forth by the United Nations, and so forth, it’s a waste of my time to proceed with this discourse any further.  It’s like trying to explain to a 2 year old why a car won’t “go” when it’s out of gas and they still insist (angrily) that it go anyway and proceed to blame me because it won’t…  Once you accept the premise that there are laws that we must follow as US citizens (until the those laws are, indeed, changed),your squawking and your pseudo intellectual posturing are wastes of your time, as well.

Oh,... sorry you felt my screeds were, “angry” and “enraged” and so forth.  How terrible would that be? But, I feel none of these emotions, actually.  I guess my true emotional state was lost in translation…it’s something more like:  ho hum.  Most of you pro illegal sympathizers, however, seem to be quite upset…  It’s alright.  Keep hammering away at American citizens who disagree with you.  I am sure you will make A LOT of progress in persuading folks to ignore the law and to transcend the ties that bind us all.

Get an education at:  http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/casecode/uscodes/8/chapters/12/subchapters/ii/parts/viii/toc.html

[ Edited: 08 November 2007 05:08 AM by slockster ]
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Posted: 08 November 2007 05:12 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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slockster - 08 November 2007 04:32 AM

It’s pretty futile to discuss with any of you the facts of illegal immigration such as U.S. Law.  If you don’t understand the basic concepts of the American Legal system, the mandates set forth by the United Nations, and so forth, it’s a waste of my time to proceed with this discourse any further.  It’s like trying to explain to a 2 year old why a car won’t “go” when it’s out of gas and they still insist (angrily) that it go anyway and proceed to blame me because it won’t…  Once you accept the premise that there are laws that we must follow as US citizens (until the those laws are, indeed, changed),your squawking and your pseudo intellectual posturing are wastes of your time, as well.

Sounds like fascism to me.  Slavery was once law too.

If it makes you feel any better, I am not in the habit of breaking laws.

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Posted: 08 November 2007 05:41 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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Perhaps it would be a more worthwhile discussion if we explore why the US immigration laws were instituted in the first place…  I really have no idea and I would be very interested in hearing from anyone knowledgeable of this subject.

PS

How does one upload a profile picture?

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Posted: 17 November 2007 11:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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erasmusinfinity - 07 November 2007 10:17 PM
skepticdave - 07 November 2007 09:02 PM

What part of “ILLEGAL” don’t we understand?

If you don’t like the law…...........change it…......until then…

If your quote here was addressed to me, then I think you missed my point.  I am also against the “illegal” aspect.

As I said before, stop crooked Americans from undercutting wage and benefit laws and the whole of the illegal immigrant problem will vanish in a jiff.  That means stop “illegal” American business practices.  How many “illegal” immigrants do you really think would find work in America if businesses had to pay them minimum wage plus benefits?  Going after immigrants who are looking for a better life is about as brilliant as going after heroin addicts without concern for the dealer.

Of course, we do need to make all immigration “legal” and document it.  Prohibition wasn’t good law either.  So much so that it was unreasonable to expect people to follow it.

skepticdave - 07 November 2007 09:02 PM

I’m not anti-immigration mind you, just anti-illegal immigration.

Your tone makes me skeptical.  Along those lines, you don’t sound much like the guy in your picture.

I’ve stated before that the immigrants are not the only subjects to hold accountable. Corporations, employers, advertisers, all those who capitalize on illegal immigration are accountable too. Lou Dobbs is very anti-illegal but pro-legal immigration. Skeptical about him and his tone as well?

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Posted: 19 November 2007 06:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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Well, Lou seems to get the futility of building a wall at the border of Mexico.  That’s a plus, and he does stands up for immigrants in certain cases.  But, he doesn’t talk enough about how global economics are THE factor that creates these problems.

The degree of inequity that is placed on humans living south of the US border is so extreme that it would be foolish not to attempt to cross into the US.  This inequity is caused by global-economic conditions that are as much the fault of Americans as it is the fault of dictators and lack of organization within these countries.  Further, the existence of such dictators and this lack of organization in the third world is as much the fault of the US and the international community as it is internal.

This problem is not unique to the US.  The same thing is happening in Europe and in ALL other rich countries.  It is the result of a global apartheid system.

The simple two step solution…  stop crooked American businesses from breaking the laws that protect workers rights in the US.  This is nothing more of an enforcement of the laws that are already in place and will stop illegal immigration entirely in its tracks.  Second, require foreign businesses that conduct trade with the US to follow similar standards for worker treatment within their own countries.  As their living standards increase, their citizens won’t feel compelled to flea to “the land of milk and honey.”

Why haven’t these things happened?  Because there is too much money to be made by continuing the exploitation.

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Posted: 19 November 2007 03:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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erasmusinfinity - 19 November 2007 06:06 AM

Why haven’t these things happened?  Because there is too much money to be made by continuing the exploitation.

I couldn’t agree more.

Don’t forget the cost of China’s cheap labor undercuts that of Mexico and even Latin America etc.. and we all know how poorly paid those workers are and the sweatshop conditions in which they work. Outsourcing labor to China by Mexico also contributes to America’s illegal immigration problem. Mexico is even losing 5 dollar a day jobs to China. So, what to do about China? Same thing, it’s all about the money…...the profit motive.

Fix greed, avarice and unfettered capitalism on crack and that would fix a lot of the world’s problems.  But for the most part, that’s chasing a chimera.

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Posted: 19 November 2007 05:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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skepticdave,

I may have been wrong about you not sounding like Noam Chomsky!  LOL

But wouldn’t Chomsky proceed by chasing the chimera?  hmmm

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Posted: 20 November 2007 03:05 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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erasmusinfinity - 19 November 2007 05:03 PM

skepticdave,

I may have been wrong about you not sounding like Noam Chomsky!  LOL

But wouldn’t Chomsky proceed by chasing the chimera?  hmmm

haha, yeah.
Chomsky has an awesome and enormous history of working for change and social justice. I’m just a bit pessimistic about “changing the whole world”. Yeah, change can and does happen though.

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