morgantj - 06 March 2008 01:14 PM

Since you brought up atheism, that reminds me that people are taught to believe that it is reasonable to believe that god exist. They didn’t inherit that. They learned it.

I don’t think I’ve answered the rest of your post. It would be interesting to see if an adopted child of a religious fanatic brought up in a family that encourages the child to think rationally might one day decide that the universe really looks as if it was designed. I am inclined to believe he/she would.

Actually, my previous post just assured me that rational thinking can’t be learned: I am walking proof of it. What nonsense!

whatever.

I know. Sorry for making a mess in your thread. I apologize.

George - 06 March 2008 10:35 PM

I know. Sorry for making a mess in your thread. I apologize.

A mess! Hardly. I think it will be rather telling to anyone who reads it.

Well yes, it does indeed. I could have instead googled “genetic predisposition to religion” and paraphrase those who know what they are talking about. If I were afraid to speculate and run the risk of making a complete fool of myself, I would instead spend all of my time on the goddamn Wiki. Have you ever thought why there are 80 guests locked in at most of the time but there are no more that two dozens of active members? It is because people are afraid to be wrong. And the fact that scientists get a special welcome when joining this forum doesn’t help either.

Considering the subject is the disrespect for truth.

So is it a non acceptance of facts or just a denial? people lie (usually) to hide something, after all is not the Penultimate truth, you cannot tell the truth, because it hurts.
Besides people love their myths, and will cleave to them, long after the facts have been presented.

Is there a God and why should he be Christian?

“Truth is one of the rarest commodities in the times we are living through, to expose it to the masses is tantamount to slapping the entrenched power structure of the United States in their very face, but which, at times, someone needs to take the risk and do, otherwise, and what we are seeing in America now, lies become the truth because they are more comfortable for people to believe.”

David Booth

Roger_Bacon - 07 March 2008 02:54 PM

Is there a God and why should he be Christian?

It’s not.  It’s I am.  Don’t ask me what that is, but it is found in Hinduism, Judaism, Christianity…

So most adherents prefer a patriarchy?

Roger, I was being fictious and I also called it an “it” not a “he”.

I’ve written (co-written) a book on this subject, by the way. It’s called Why Truth Matters. There’s a Point of Inquiry interview on the same subject last July - I think you can find it on the Point of Inquiry thread.

I think it’s true that there’s a lot of disrespect for truth kicking around. I edit a website that collects examples of that every day; I’m never short of material.

morgantj - 04 March 2008 07:32 AM

Is it just me, or my environment in the States, because I seem to be detecting more and more people having little regard for the truth. It seems as if people don’t value the truth as much as they should. I see a common trend of people choosing comfort and happiness over truth. What are you thoughts?

I’ve found this to be a reality unfortunately with quite a few people that I’ve had philosophical and theological discussions/debates with. I recently had a debate through a series of emails with a born again Christian. I told him from the start that the only way that I’d have a serious conversation with him was if he valued truth above all things.

He claimed to value truth, but later admitted that the only reason he ever considers any information that conflicts with his beliefs, is to show how it’s flawed. He essentially told me that there’s no way he’d ever consider anything new again. Our emails began to slow down when he couldn’t make a logical argument for me to become Christian. Its been 2 months since he last emailed me.

I agree with what’s already been pointed out, people are afraid of what might threaten their current understanding on the way things are. And if that just so happens to be “the truth”, well then, to hell with the truth. Gimme my story any day of the week.

A Unitarian minister I knew used to describe truth as being many faceted.  Just because we have different ideas, doesn’t mean that one sees truth and another doesn’t because we are just seeing different facets.  I pointed out that staying with the metaphor of a jewel with many faces, some of them are nice and flat and clear, but others are optically severely distorted and clouded over.  What people using those see is a pretty mucked up and warped version of “truth”.  She agreed and said that that’s why we shouldn’t be satisfied with our present views, but rather should keep considering new ideas.  She was a pretty sharp woman.

Apparently, your born-again Christian didn’t share her ideas, but then she defined her religious beliefs as that of a spiritual atheist (whatever that means).

Occam

Ophelia Benson - 09 March 2008 10:30 AM

I’ve written (co-written) a book on this subject, by the way. It’s called Why Truth Matters. There’s a Point of Inquiry interview on the same subject last July - I think you can find it on the Point of Inquiry thread.

I think it’s true that there’s a lot of disrespect for truth kicking around. I edit a website that collects examples of that every day; I’m never short of material.

Yes, I remember that podcast. I listened to it. I’ll be checking out your website. Thanks for keeping it real.

Roger_Bacon - 07 March 2008 02:54 PM

Besides people love their myths, and will cleave to them, long after the facts have been presented.

Exactly, hence the subject, “Disrespect for truth?” So it seems you are agreeing that there is a disrespect for truth?