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scientifically speaking: there is an afterlife
Posted: 11 August 2008 07:33 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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citizenschallenge - 09 August 2008 11:47 PM

I feel secure knowing I exist on the knife edge of an infinity going in both directions; being a product of all that came before and in the end adding the echo of my existence, my soul, to all that comes after I depart this Earth.  Alright, maybe it is a small echo, yet it fills me with a sense of glorious belonging to God and creation infinity more solid than anything I’ve heard from those mesmerizing, pick-pocketing, double talking televangelists.

It’s actually sadly funny: we humans haven’t even figured out how to get along with our neighbors or rein in our suicidal greed impulse, but are still presumptuous enough to claim we “know” God…. get real.  None of us know.  God is too big for our petty human minds to grasp. 

Isn’t it time we stop obsessing about our varied self-serving interpretations of “the true God” and start focusing on understanding God’s fantastic creation, our part in it and how best to nurture it for those generations of life yet to come?

What do you mean by “God?”

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Posted: 11 August 2008 07:51 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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citizenschallenge - 09 August 2008 11:47 PM

Isn’t it time we stop obsessing about our varied self-serving interpretations of “the true God” and start focusing on understanding God’s fantastic creation, our part in it and how best to nurture it for those generations of life yet to come?

PLaClair - 11 August 2008 07:33 PM

What do you mean by “God?”

The universe and its giant random number generators?

Engineers finally built the biggest, most complex, AI computer system ever created. They uploaded into it every book ever written in every language. They waited several weeks until one day the monitor blinked “READY >” (Like a TRS-80 Model I?)

Carefully they typed in question # 1: “Is there a God”?

Nothing happened for several minutes. Finally an answer appeared on the screen:

“There is now”.

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Posted: 12 August 2008 03:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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citizenschallenge - 09 August 2008 11:47 PM

Where does all that leave our afterlife?  Look around at our world - everything is connected to everything else, not just across the Earth, but through the billions of days that have preceded this one. 

This isn’t what most people mean by an afterlife, is it?

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Posted: 12 August 2008 05:57 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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danlhinz - 11 August 2008 04:42 PM

Further more I don’t care what happens in the universe after I have died. The only thing that is important is enjoying your life now and not being overly sentimental because all your possessions, friends, and family will also stop existing someday too. I think kids have problems with death because life seems static when you are young and it’s hard to imagine everything you love going away.

That’s dangerous. I think we must care what happens in the universe after we die - to the extent that our presence affects that future.

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Posted: 12 August 2008 11:35 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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traveler - 12 August 2008 05:57 AM

That’s dangerous. I think we must care what happens in the universe after we die - to the extent that our presence affects that future.

I meant more along the lines of the daily goings on in the future, politics etc. that will be issues the next generation faces. The point I was trying to make is that you should care now because you have to be alive to see the results of your actions, and because existence is impermanent people should not obsess about life(humanity) after they are dead.

I don’t condone trashing the environment and setting off a nukes on my death bed if that’s how you interpreted it. cool smile

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Posted: 12 August 2008 02:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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danlhinz - 12 August 2008 11:35 AM
traveler - 12 August 2008 05:57 AM

That’s dangerous. I think we must care what happens in the universe after we die - to the extent that our presence affects that future.

I meant more along the lines of the daily goings on in the future, politics etc. that will be issues the next generation faces. The point I was trying to make is that you should care now because you have to be alive to see the results of your actions, and because existence is impermanent people should not obsess about life(humanity) after they are dead.

I don’t condone trashing the environment and setting off a nukes on my death bed if that’s how you interpreted it. cool smile

Based on other posts by you, I figured that was the case. cool smile

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Posted: 14 August 2008 07:40 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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traveler - 10 August 2008 06:53 AM

I don’t feel that way. Ok?


you write:  I don’t feel that way. Ok?
but then you sign:
Every reasonable person must strive to promote moderation and a more objective judgement. A.E.


... and I say right-on.


Let me try my last line again:  Isn’t it time we stop obsessing about our varied self interests and start focusing on this incredible earth we are an integral part of. 
To honestly appreciate how deeply we have effected it’s Biosphere and the need for a dynamically different approach - if our progeny is to experience an enjoyable life style.

>>>  start focusing on understanding this fantastic earth, our part in it and how best to nurture it for those generations of life yet to come?  <<<

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Posted: 14 August 2008 07:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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PLaClair - 11 August 2008 07:33 PM
citizenschallenge - 09 August 2008 11:47 PM

I feel secure knowing I exist on the knife edge of an infinity going in both directions; being a product of all that came before and in the end adding the echo of my existence, my soul, to all that comes after I depart this Earth.  Alright, maybe it is a small echo, yet it fills me with a sense of glorious belonging to God and creation infinity more solid than anything I’ve heard from those mesmerizing, pick-pocketing, double talking televangelists.


What do you mean by “God?”

Beautiful question and I don’t have a clue. 
But to be honest I don’t have a clue what love is, though I’ve touched it on a great many levels.

OK, that’s overly dramatic… if true. 

Let me rephrase your question: What is your experience of God? 

Given that question, I’d say god has been a wisp of wind past my shoulder that’s profoundly influenced my actions now and again.

A something that has reached into my soul now and again - when the idiotic hopelessness of it all has taken its toll, and filled me with wonder at the rising sun and its rays of warmth - while injecting an adrenaline rush that says:  OK, here I am, let’s get on with it, for tomorrow this moment will be gone.

I know it’s all very poetic and mushy, but so be it.

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Posted: 14 August 2008 08:04 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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Hmmm, your text is incorrectly captioned. I really can’t see PlaClair say that ‘god touched’ him.

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Posted: 14 August 2008 08:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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“There is now”.[/color]


Oh gosh, give me a break.

and “if a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to hear it, does it still make noise?”


Standing on the beach may mesmerize you into believing there is only this one wave.
But that’s your personal perception.
That wave wouldn’t exist without the previous one, or the one pushing it from behind.

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Posted: 14 August 2008 08:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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citizenschallenge - 14 August 2008 08:06 PM

“There is now”.


Oh gosh, give me a break.

and “if a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to hear it, does it still make noise?”


Standing on the beach may mesmerize you into believing there is only this one wave.
But that’s your personal perception.
That wave wouldn’t exist without the previous one, or the one pushing it from behind.

 

....and you will find that there is a scientific explanation for both the tree fall and the waves.
I forgot to add that it would be reproducible.

[ Edited: 14 August 2008 08:11 PM by asanta ]
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Posted: 14 August 2008 08:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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Jackson - 12 August 2008 03:10 AM
citizenschallenge - 09 August 2008 11:47 PM

Where does all that leave our afterlife?  Look around at our world - everything is connected to everything else, not just across the Earth, but through the billions of days that have preceded this one. 

This isn’t what most people mean by an afterlife, is it?

————————————————————————————————————————

Well yes, and the way I see it - that is the great challenge.

To get people to pull their heads out of the sand and reevaluate their cartoon image of creation/evolution and the God/heaven concept in general - but I do not believe that can be done by trying to hold god in contempt. 

Their is that something that is undoubtedly beyond ourselves - at least I’ve sure experienced it.
Add all the labels to it you want - God is as valid as any other.

What’s important is that the masses start to appreciate the scientific implications of our bodies and the chemo-electro magnetic dance within and how it is undeniably connected with the rest of creation.  Along with understand our Biosphere and the reality of diminishing resources vs. a society dependent on ceaseless growth of consumption.

Does any of this make sense to you?

What I despise most about today’s society and its media (and even how much of its science is translated) is its two dimensionality.

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Posted: 14 August 2008 08:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
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traveler - 12 August 2008 05:57 AM
danlhinz - 11 August 2008 04:42 PM

Further more I don’t care what happens in the universe after I have died. The only thing that is important is enjoying your life now and not being overly sentimental because all your possessions, friends, and family will also stop existing someday too. I think kids have problems with death because life seems static when you are young and it’s hard to imagine everything you love going away.

That’s dangerous. I think we must care what happens in the universe after we die - to the extent that our presence affects that future.

 


YIPPY   modern morality

He who dies with the most toys wins

let me ask you:  if a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to hear it, does it still make noise?

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Posted: 14 August 2008 08:28 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
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I meant more along the lines of the daily goings on in the future, politics etc. that will be issues the next generation faces. The point I was trying to make is that you should care now because you have to be alive to see the results of your actions, and because existence is impermanent people should not obsess about life(humanity) after they are dead.

I don’t condone trashing the environment and setting off a nukes on my death bed if that’s how you interpreted it. cool smile

=============================================
but you don’t care about your daily goings on?

Does this mean you think what you do and how you think has no effect on the future?

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Posted: 14 August 2008 08:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
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asanta - 14 August 2008 08:09 PM
citizenschallenge - 14 August 2008 08:06 PM

“There is now”.


Oh gosh, give me a break.

and “if a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to hear it, does it still make noise?”


Standing on the beach may mesmerize you into believing there is only this one wave.
But that’s your personal perception.
That wave wouldn’t exist without the previous one, or the one pushing it from behind.

 

....and you will find that there is a scientific explanation for both the tree fall and the waves.
I forgot to add that it would be reproducible.

=========================================

god help me - no one get’s it…. or me

Of course that tree makes noise, just as much as your life is the product of what cames before and will resonate with what comes after

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