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Atheist sign joins nativity scene, tree at Capitol
Posted: 13 December 2008 07:33 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 61 ]
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Ecrasez l’infame! - 13 December 2008 02:45 PM

I find the acceptance of Christmas by many of you perplexing.  Do you often lie to your children and other friends and family members? 

Are you really perplexed or is that just rhetoric?

Here is a partial quote from Richard Dawkins (Google gives 400,000+ sites for richard dawkins Christmas)

“Presumably your reason for asking me is that ‘The God Delusion’ is an atheistic book, and you still think of Christmas as a religious festival,” Mr. Dawkins wrote, in a reply printed here in its entirety. “But of course it has long since ceased to be a religious festival. I participate for family reasons, with a reluctance that owes more to aesthetics than atheistics. I detest Jingle Bells, White Christmas, Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer, and the obscene spending bonanza that nowadays seems to occupy not just December, but November and much of October, too.”

He added: “So divorced has Christmas become from religion that I find no necessity to bother with euphemisms such as happy holiday season. In the same way as many of my friends call themselves Jewish atheists, I acknowledge that I come from Christian cultural roots. I am a post-Christian atheist. So, understanding full well that the phrase retains zero religious significance, I unhesitatingly wish everyone a Merry Christmas.”

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Posted: 14 December 2008 03:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 62 ]
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Ecrasez l’infame! - 13 December 2008 02:45 PM

I find the acceptance of Christmas by many of you perplexing.  Do you often lie to your children and other friends and family members?

Hmm, sometimes…

Have you ever read The Count of Monte Cristo? I am sure you haven’t since there are many who believe themselves to be Napoleon. You would surely find that perplexing, right? I assume you don’t watch Star Trek either because of Trekkie phanatics. What about, I don’t know, Michelangelo? Would you ever visit the Sistine Chapel or go and see the Pieta?

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Posted: 14 December 2008 04:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 63 ]
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Christmas always was a thoroughly pagan holiday- we are just stealing it back from the Christians.  I no more buy into the “truth” of Jesus’ birth myth than the average Christian buys into the tree spirit represented by that decorated tree in the living room.

Santa Claus is a child’s first great lesson in skepticism.  Everyone talks about Santa, everyone contributes to the illusion, and even ones own parents are in on the deception (a very pleasant one, unless the “sees you while you’re sleeping” bit gets taken too far).  But every child eventually figures out it is all a big lie, and learns, hopefully, to question everything else in the future.  I think it is a wonderful tradition, and I was so proud of my boys when they eventually figured it out and confronted me with their conclusions!  Yet even now when they come home from college, I have to sneak the presents down under the tree after they go to bed, just for the fun of it.

Merry Christmas, all!

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When I was 15 years old, I could no longer reconcile religion with reality, and I knew one of them would have to go.  It still amazes me how many people make the other choice.

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Posted: 16 December 2008 04:26 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 64 ]
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I like that some humanists are using the “Tree of Knowledge” as their holiday tree.  Perhaps dissenters should decorates trees with big red apples that say “forbidden fruit” on them. 

As for government displays, I propose re-doing the nativity scene, with the manger being a little Trojan horse, maybe with flames and/or “hellfire” painted on it and little devils coming out of it… perhaps it would be too much to have a pile of horse doodoo with “Inquisition” , “Witch Trials” , “Subjection of Women”, etc. written on it.

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“Mary is the Yoko Ono of the Holy Family… and Satan is the Ringo.  It wouldn’t be the same without him- sometimes they even let him sing”

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Posted: 16 December 2008 05:11 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 65 ]
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gatogreensleeves - 16 December 2008 04:26 PM

I like that some humanists are using the “Tree of Knowledge” as their holiday tree.  Perhaps dissenters should decorates trees with big red apples that say “forbidden fruit” on them. 

As for government displays, I propose re-doing the nativity scene, with the manger being a little Trojan horse, maybe with flames and/or “hellfire” painted on it and little devils coming out of it… perhaps it would be too much to have a pile of horse doodoo with “Inquisition” , “Witch Trials” , “Subjection of Women”, etc. written on it.

LOL

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Church; where sheep congregate to worship a zombie on a stick that turns into a cracker on Sundays…

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Posted: 16 December 2008 05:24 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 66 ]
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Of course the apples would be eaten ceremoniously, either by the family… or “Santa!”  You know… with an apple core by the fireplace in the morning.

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“Mary is the Yoko Ono of the Holy Family… and Satan is the Ringo.  It wouldn’t be the same without him- sometimes they even let him sing”

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Posted: 16 December 2008 06:30 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 67 ]
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gatogreensleeves - 16 December 2008 05:24 PM

Of course the apples would be eaten ceremoniously, either by the family… or “Santa!”  You know… with an apple core by the fireplace in the morning.

Keep going, you’re creating a whole new tradition!!! LOL

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Church; where sheep congregate to worship a zombie on a stick that turns into a cracker on Sundays…

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Posted: 16 December 2008 07:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 68 ]
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.

[ Edited: 24 December 2008 10:12 PM by Luke Vogel ]
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Posted: 16 December 2008 07:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 69 ]
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[ Edited: 24 December 2008 10:12 PM by Luke Vogel ]
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Posted: 17 December 2008 12:29 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 70 ]
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asanta - 16 December 2008 06:30 PM
gatogreensleeves - 16 December 2008 05:24 PM

Of course the apples would be eaten ceremoniously, either by the family… or “Santa!”  You know… with an apple core by the fireplace in the morning.

Keep going, you’re creating a whole new tradition!!! LOL

Oh, you have no idea… I’ve already constructed a base platform for a related website:

APOLOGETIC MINISTRIES FOR THE CHURCH OF SANTA CLAUS

Abstract: An apologetics website that defends the belief that the eternal Santa Claus exists and has all of the powers ascribed to him in Christmas songs, etc., with information on the doctrine of the prophet Santa Claus as is relayed through Santa inspired songs.

This information includes:
1.  Santa’s purpose: to give presents to good people and humiliate the bad people by not giving them presents.
2.  Santa’s powers: quasi-omniscience (“He sees you when you’re sleeping, He knows when you’re awake, he knows if you’ve been bad or good,” quasi-omnipresence, levitation, shape shifting (to fit down chimneys), unquenchable appetite (milk and cookies at almost every house), etc. 
3.  Well documented rebuttals to criticism that the existence of Santa Claus, as he is portrayed by millions of people around the world every year, is false.
4.  Essays defending Santa’s goodness and Clausian thought.

What makes the Church of Santa Claus similar to, but even better than Christianity?

a.  Santa does miracles every year and won’t send you to hell.
b.  All Santa songs are inspired by Santa and are profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, and for instruction in righteousness… (but there are some that are false!!  These are analogous to biblical Apocrypha).
c.  There are superior Clausian equivalents to everything Christian: Santa instead of the convoluted notion of a God/Jesus/Holy Spirit Trinity (and Santa, of course, has similar powers of supernatural knowledge, quasi- omnipresence, levitation, and other various miracles.  Santa is eternal, omni- benevolent and lives to give), Santa’s first earthly existence can be proven historically, unlike Jesus, elves and black Petes instead of “angels,” Santa’s workshop at the North Pole instead of “heaven” in some other dimension, nine- not twelve, reindeer (Rudolph is “Peter”), Santa encourages people to write Him letters of what they want… similar to “prayer” but much more organized, etc…
d.  There is proof of Santa’s actual historical existence (and therefore also His supposedly mythical existence) as Sinterklaas, Saint Nicholas of Myra, Kristopher Kringle (an eternal being with shape-shifting abilities gets bored with one measly form).
e.  Santa has a strict moral code (be vigilant, don’t cry, don’t pout) that’s attainable.
f.  Would you rather have your kids sit on Santa’s lap or the local priest?


3. Controversial Issues:

a.  Does Santa advocate altruism?  The Words say, “He knows if you’ve been bad or good” (a veiled threat that how you behave will determine whether or not you’ll get what you want on Dec. 24th), “so be good for goodness’ sake” (isn’t this superfluous after the previous line?  They’re already terrified they won’t get what they want if they misbehave)
b.  Claus and effect- omnipresent or just REALLY fast?
c.  Clausian decadence.  Why is Santa obese?  Should one eat as much as they want if they can do it without dying? 
d.  Should Santa be able to whip his reindeer, and if so, should he whip his elves too?
e.  Is Santa a communist?

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“Mary is the Yoko Ono of the Holy Family… and Satan is the Ringo.  It wouldn’t be the same without him- sometimes they even let him sing”

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Posted: 17 December 2008 12:37 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 71 ]
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I love it!!!! Keep going! What about the long suffering Mrs. Claus, and why aren’t there any jr. Santas? Are reindeer eternal too? And if you are really, really poor, but really, really good, why didn’t Santa bring you presents? And if you are really, really rich but really, really bad and obnoxious, why did you get toys, despite Santa’s watching you?

[ Edited: 17 December 2008 12:41 AM by asanta ]
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Church; where sheep congregate to worship a zombie on a stick that turns into a cracker on Sundays…

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Posted: 17 December 2008 12:59 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 72 ]
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HAHA!  Well, in the case of poor children, it’s because they didn’t have enough faith.  In the case of the rich, it’s because Santa advocates giving twice as many presents to the rich… because he knows they will get spoiled and be proportionately unhappy later in life… especially when they are envied, mobbed, and robbed by the poor. 

Santa’s children have to do godhood training on a planet called Snolob (no relation to the Mormon God planet Kolob… okay, it is pretty close by actually), so we don’t see them. 

Apologists are working hard at finding a way to get Mrs. Asherah Claus out of the picture. 

Thank you asanta, these will go under Controversial Issues!

Oh yes, flying reindeer are only eternal by Santa’s will, otherwise they are automata!  Yes, elves are eternal too, also by Santa’s good grace!!!

[ Edited: 17 December 2008 01:03 AM by Gatogreensleeves ]
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“Mary is the Yoko Ono of the Holy Family… and Satan is the Ringo.  It wouldn’t be the same without him- sometimes they even let him sing”

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