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Two false verses in the Quran?
Posted: 21 April 2009 12:56 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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The number 5 is MY personal favorite, I want to know how often a multiple of 5 shows up….. smile , if not, I’ll take multiples of 37 instead!
Honestly, this sounds like another variation of the ‘bible code’. smirk

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Posted: 21 April 2009 09:58 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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Hi,

Being a skeptic is a very good thing, being dishonnest is a very bad thing.
I will simply say that being a skeptic with sincerity of heart will keep us away from dishonnesty and protect us from being manipulated.
Skepticism does not necessarily mean being an atheist either, at least your entire life.
Also if you claim Muhammad was a savant, is it a pure supposition or do you have any ground for it? If you study in depth the issue of the authorship of the Quran with sincerity, especially in the light of scientific data coded in the Quran, you may find it more logical that, rather than claiming Muhammad was a incredible savant lost in the desert, it may be (more simply) that Quran is from the one it claims it is from: God.
It is also always possible to claim that extra terrestrial intelligence manufactured Quran and that they flew to planet earth in a flying saucer to deliver it; It is possible to claim or make up anything. In the end, what is the origin of life in the universe, who created the extra terrestrial life some people would claim Quran is from…it all comes down, in my opinion, to One supra-intelligent original designer.

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Posted: 21 April 2009 10:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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Pierre - 21 April 2009 09:58 AM

...it all comes down, in my opinion, to One supra-intelligent original designer.

What does? That a book has a number of nineteens in it?

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Posted: 21 April 2009 01:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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Pierre - 21 April 2009 09:58 AM

Hi,
In the end, what is the origin of life in the universe, who created the extra terrestrial life some people would claim Quran is from…it all comes down, in my opinion, to One supra-intelligent original designer.

Pierre, your leap of logic leaves me dumbfounded.I fail to see how the presence of a number that can be manipulated into existence would ‘prove’ the existence of ‘‘One supra-intelligent original designer’‘.I’m sure I could manipulate the text to find reams of 23s, 47s or any other number I desire as well as whoever, found his 19s.

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Posted: 21 April 2009 03:50 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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asanta - 21 April 2009 01:23 PM
Pierre - 21 April 2009 09:58 AM

Hi,
In the end, what is the origin of life in the universe, who created the extra terrestrial life some people would claim Quran is from…it all comes down, in my opinion, to One supra-intelligent original designer.

Pierre, your leap of logic leaves me dumbfounded.I fail to see how the presence of a number that can be manipulated into existence would ‘prove’ the existence of ‘‘One supra-intelligent original designer’‘.I’m sure I could manipulate the text to find reams of 23s, 47s or any other number I desire as well as whoever, found his 19s.

Hi Asanta and all,

Can you really find something similar?:
► There are 6346 verses in the Quran (19 x 334, 6234 numbered and 112 unnumbered verses called Bismillahs), and 6 +3 + 4 + 6 = 19
► There are 114 suras (chapters) in the Quran (19 x 6)
► The word God occurs 2698 times (19 x 142)
► The word Quran, refering to God, occurs exactly 57 times, (19 x 3)
► All suras, but one, start with the following statement: “In the Name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful” (commonly known as the “Bismillah”), which occurs 114 times, 19 x 6, in the entire Quran (one extra Bismillah is found in 27:30). This fundamental statement is composed with 19 letters.
► Each of the four key words (Name, God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful) of the opening statement (Bismillah) occur in multiples of 19 throughout the Quran, without exception:

4 pure Arabic forms of the words of the Bismillah: “In the name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful” (19 letters)
Frequency in the entire Quran:
Ism (name): 19
God: 2698 = 19 x 142
Most Gracious: 57 = 19 x 3
Glorious: 57 = 19 x 3
Most Merciful: 114 = 19 x 6
Total (combined frequency): 2888 = 19x19x8 (8 is the index of 19).

Only four gematrical values of attributes of God, out of more than 400, are multiple of 19 in the entire Quran:
One: 19
Possessor of Infinite Grace: 2698 = 19 x 142
Most Gracious: 57 = 19 x 3
Gatherer: 114 = 19 x 6

► The Addition of the gematrical value of the three names of God Allah (66) + Al Rahman (329) + Al Raheem (289) = 684 = 19 x 36.
► Number 684 (19 x 36) is also the gematrical value of “Al Quran Al Kareem” (the holy Quran).
► There are exactly 1919 verses in the entire Quran which include one or more of the four words of the Bismillah.

This is a sample of the phenomenon.
Quran announces that 19 is not a random number:
“Over it is 19” (sura 74:30)

If you manage to find something similar in any book on earth (I am not talking about the plethora of other well designed 19 based properties associated with the Bismillah alone and the Quran at large…), the book telling you specifically that “over it is 19” (or other number), then let me know, that would leave me literally…dumbfounded.
Good luck.

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Posted: 21 April 2009 04:03 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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So..they had an abacus and were fascinated with the number 19…so what. I think this is even MORE awesome….was it written by ‘god’ too???? Do you know how hard it is to get rid of those pesky ‘e’s????

              Gadsby
      A Story of Over 50,000 Words
      Without Using the Letter “E”
        by Ernest Vincent Wright

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Posted: 21 April 2009 04:06 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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Dear Asanta,

It’s OK, I am not here to try to convince you.

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Posted: 21 April 2009 04:13 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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Pierre - 21 April 2009 04:06 PM

Dear Asanta,

It’s OK, I am not here to try to convince you.

I really don’t think you’re doing a good job of convincing anyone else here either. Which brings me to the question ..what exactly did you hope to accomplish? Certainly not to convince a bunch of atheist, agnostics and skeptics—-it’s just NOT going to happen!...... And you did not post here to have us convince YOU of the error of your thinking…...so what IS your point?

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Posted: 21 April 2009 04:40 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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asanta - 21 April 2009 04:13 PM
Pierre - 21 April 2009 04:06 PM

Dear Asanta,

It’s OK, I am not here to try to convince you.

I really don’t think you’re doing a good job of convincing anyone else here either. Which brings me to the question ..what exactly did you hope to accomplish? Certainly not to convince a bunch of atheist, agnostics and skeptics—-it’s just NOT going to happen!...... And you did not post here to have us convince YOU of the error of your thinking…...so what IS your point?

Well, I think you can only speak for yourself.  grin
I am simply here to present and pass down a message I believe in genuinely without expecting anything in return.

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Posted: 21 April 2009 04:44 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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Pierre - 21 April 2009 04:40 PM
asanta - 21 April 2009 04:13 PM
Pierre - 21 April 2009 04:06 PM

Dear Asanta,

It’s OK, I am not here to try to convince you.

I really don’t think you’re doing a good job of convincing anyone else here either. Which brings me to the question ..what exactly did you hope to accomplish? Certainly not to convince a bunch of atheist, agnostics and skeptics—-it’s just NOT going to happen!...... And you did not post here to have us convince YOU of the error of your thinking…...so what IS your point?

Well, I think you can only speak for yourself.  grin

True, but based on past reactions of the forum, I doubt that I am incorrect in this guess.  grin

I am simply here to present and pass down a message I believe in genuinely without expecting anything in return.

Thanks, but I don’t think your message is one that will find much resonance here.  smile

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Posted: 21 April 2009 06:29 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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This is not a topic of interest to me.  First, with any book with a wide variety of topics and decent length, if one starts playing enough games one can find all sorts of interesting “apparent” correlations.  It’s just a normal property of our number system. Then one can point these out and claim they have some specific meaning.  Second, if one goes through and checks out all these specific items, one is often surprised to find that they weren’t quite right, either because of a miscount or because the originator fudged the data.

Occam

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Posted: 21 April 2009 06:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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Pierre - 21 April 2009 03:50 PM
asanta - 21 April 2009 01:23 PM
Pierre - 21 April 2009 09:58 AM

Hi,
In the end, what is the origin of life in the universe, who created the extra terrestrial life some people would claim Quran is from…it all comes down, in my opinion, to One supra-intelligent original designer.

Pierre, your leap of logic leaves me dumbfounded.I fail to see how the presence of a number that can be manipulated into existence would ‘prove’ the existence of ‘‘One supra-intelligent original designer’‘.I’m sure I could manipulate the text to find reams of 23s, 47s or any other number I desire as well as whoever, found his 19s.

Hi Asanta and all,

Can you really find something similar?:
► There are 6346 verses in the Quran (19 x 334, 6234 numbered and 112 unnumbered verses called Bismillahs), and 6 +3 + 4 + 6 = 19
► There are 114 suras (chapters) in the Quran (19 x 6)
► The word God occurs 2698 times (19 x 142)
► The word Quran, refering to God, occurs exactly 57 times, (19 x 3)
► All suras, but one, start with the following statement: “In the Name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful” (commonly known as the “Bismillah”), which occurs 114 times, 19 x 6, in the entire Quran (one extra Bismillah is found in 27:30). This fundamental statement is composed with 19 letters.
► Each of the four key words (Name, God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful) of the opening statement (Bismillah) occur in multiples of 19 throughout the Quran, without exception:

4 pure Arabic forms of the words of the Bismillah: “In the name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful” (19 letters)
Frequency in the entire Quran:
Ism (name): 19
God: 2698 = 19 x 142
Most Gracious: 57 = 19 x 3
Glorious: 57 = 19 x 3
Most Merciful: 114 = 19 x 6
Total (combined frequency): 2888 = 19x19x8 (8 is the index of 19).

Only four gematrical values of attributes of God, out of more than 400, are multiple of 19 in the entire Quran:
One: 19
Possessor of Infinite Grace: 2698 = 19 x 142
Most Gracious: 57 = 19 x 3
Gatherer: 114 = 19 x 6

► The Addition of the gematrical value of the three names of God Allah (66) + Al Rahman (329) + Al Raheem (289) = 684 = 19 x 36.
► Number 684 (19 x 36) is also the gematrical value of “Al Quran Al Kareem” (the holy Quran).
► There are exactly 1919 verses in the entire Quran which include one or more of the four words of the Bismillah.

This is a sample of the phenomenon.
Quran announces that 19 is not a random number:
“Over it is 19” (sura 74:30)

If you manage to find something similar in any book on earth (I am not talking about the plethora of other well designed 19 based properties associated with the Bismillah alone and the Quran at large…), the book telling you specifically that “over it is 19” (or other number), then let me know, that would leave me literally…dumbfounded.
Good luck.

This is exactly the same nonsense as in the Bible Code and Kabbalistic numerology. It is statistically bankrupt.

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Posted: 21 April 2009 06:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
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dougsmith - 21 April 2009 06:35 PM
Pierre - 21 April 2009 03:50 PM
asanta - 21 April 2009 01:23 PM
Pierre - 21 April 2009 09:58 AM

Hi,
In the end, what is the origin of life in the universe, who created the extra terrestrial life some people would claim Quran is from…it all comes down, in my opinion, to One supra-intelligent original designer.

Pierre, your leap of logic leaves me dumbfounded.I fail to see how the presence of a number that can be manipulated into existence would ‘prove’ the existence of ‘‘One supra-intelligent original designer’‘.I’m sure I could manipulate the text to find reams of 23s, 47s or any other number I desire as well as whoever, found his 19s.

Hi Asanta and all,

Can you really find something similar?:
► There are 6346 verses in the Quran (19 x 334, 6234 numbered and 112 unnumbered verses called Bismillahs), and 6 +3 + 4 + 6 = 19
► There are 114 suras (chapters) in the Quran (19 x 6)
► The word God occurs 2698 times (19 x 142)
► The word Quran, refering to God, occurs exactly 57 times, (19 x 3)
► All suras, but one, start with the following statement: “In the Name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful” (commonly known as the “Bismillah”), which occurs 114 times, 19 x 6, in the entire Quran (one extra Bismillah is found in 27:30). This fundamental statement is composed with 19 letters.
► Each of the four key words (Name, God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful) of the opening statement (Bismillah) occur in multiples of 19 throughout the Quran, without exception:

4 pure Arabic forms of the words of the Bismillah: “In the name of God, Most Gracious, Most Merciful” (19 letters)
Frequency in the entire Quran:
Ism (name): 19
God: 2698 = 19 x 142
Most Gracious: 57 = 19 x 3
Glorious: 57 = 19 x 3
Most Merciful: 114 = 19 x 6
Total (combined frequency): 2888 = 19x19x8 (8 is the index of 19).

Only four gematrical values of attributes of God, out of more than 400, are multiple of 19 in the entire Quran:
One: 19
Possessor of Infinite Grace: 2698 = 19 x 142
Most Gracious: 57 = 19 x 3
Gatherer: 114 = 19 x 6

► The Addition of the gematrical value of the three names of God Allah (66) + Al Rahman (329) + Al Raheem (289) = 684 = 19 x 36.
► Number 684 (19 x 36) is also the gematrical value of “Al Quran Al Kareem” (the holy Quran).
► There are exactly 1919 verses in the entire Quran which include one or more of the four words of the Bismillah.

This is a sample of the phenomenon.
Quran announces that 19 is not a random number:
“Over it is 19” (sura 74:30)

If you manage to find something similar in any book on earth (I am not talking about the plethora of other well designed 19 based properties associated with the Bismillah alone and the Quran at large…), the book telling you specifically that “over it is 19” (or other number), then let me know, that would leave me literally…dumbfounded.
Good luck.

This is exactly the same nonsense as in the Bible Code and Kabbalistic numerology. It is statistically bankrupt.

I am surprised how people say things out of the blue without being specicific. Can you explain how it is bankrupt providing a detailed argumentation?
I can tell you the earth is flat, then what?

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Posted: 21 April 2009 07:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
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I repeat….WHAT IS YOUR POINT IN POSTING HERE???? You will NOT find ‘true believers’ here—you will not convert anyone here, we’ve seen this NONSENSE before with the ‘bible codes’, we ARE NOT IMPRESSED with your (lack of) logic? What are you trying to prove?? You are not doing a good job of proving your story, we all know how easy it is to manipulate information to achieve these kinds of results, and even if it were ABSOLUTELY TRUE, and I’m not willing to concede that it is, it is too easy to manipulate the printed word as an author to get a number you are obsessed with like 19. It is FAR more difficult to write a 50,000 word book in english without using the letter ‘e’ and even more difficult to make it a well written book.

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Posted: 21 April 2009 07:31 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
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Asanta is right, Pierre, you’ll never convince anybody here: they are all but a bunch of faithless atheists. But I have always suspected there is more to the story of Pinocchio than what most people believe it to be. Now thanks to you, and the number 19, I was able to find out that Geppetto is the true God, Pinocchio is his son who suffered for our sins—eventually redeemed by the divine Fairy—and Carlo Collodi is indeed the true prophet.

This is what I have found so far:

• Chapters: 38 = 19 x 2
• First sentence contains 19 words
• The words “Pinocchio” and “boy” occur 361 times (19 x 19) (This one must be a sign!)
• The word “Talking Cricket” occurs 15 times and he is introduced to the story in a chapter 4: 15+4=19

Thank you, Pierre, for opening my eyes. I hope you will soon realize that Geppetto is the true God, not Allah, and will join me in our new religion of Pinocchioism. The divine reward has no limits. As our Lord Geppeto—bless him and grant him peace—has said repeatedly:

When you wish upon a star, makes no difference who you are, anything your heart desires, will come to you.

May Geppetto bless you all.

P.S. A copy of the true word of God can be found here.

[ Edited: 22 April 2009 08:09 AM by George ]
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