WITHTEETHS Intro, Hi everyone!
Posted: 29 April 2006 05:31 AM   [ Ignore ]
Jr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2006-04-28

Hello everyone, my actual name is Stephen, I am a student residing in Michigan, and stumbled upon this site last night. I downloaded 4 of the podcasts and listened to them all day, great stuff.

I am a secular humanist, an atheist. Why is that a taboo? And why does my grandmother think its immoral?  :shock:  I know I have morals, but they don’t come from the fear of a god who might smite, they come from within, they come from empathy and guilt. and through theses, they make compassion possible, thus leading to utilitarianism. There is no god, I am a example, I am responsible.

I even think most people are generally good, we just have contradicting viewpoints, and very limited knowledge(ignorance). A sign that we are good i believe is that we try to justify everything we do.

When did i become an atheist? I took a philosophy class, and thought about it, after long debate, i thought i would become an agnostic, then i thought about it for awhile, now I’m an atheist. There is no empirical evidence for the existence of god, its a matter of faith. ... faith, a word so magical at one time in my life. Faith is an excuse, and once you buy into it, you willingly are jumping into an abyss of unreason.

I’m fascinated by the intelligent design debates. well actually dumbfounded. How can these "moral" people keep shoving dishonest unproved unscientific statements to the table in order to confuse people, and win people over to think that ID is true. The Entropy, 2ndlaw of Thermodynamics,  the DNA mutation of new genetic code and many other are a few examples of the petty nature to scrap believers into their belief for the extra support they need in order to make themselves feel better.

I’m looking forward to debating, discussing and sharing with all of you.

with love-
WITHTEETH

 Signature 

Know Thyself

Profile
 
 
Posted: 29 April 2006 05:31 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
Jr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2006-04-28

WITHTEETHS Intro, Hi everyone!

Hello everyone, my actual name is Stephen, I am a student residing in Michigan, and stumbled upon this site last night. I downloaded 4 of the podcasts and listened to them all day, great stuff.

I am a secular humanist, an atheist. Why is that a taboo? And why does my grandmother think its immoral?  :shock:  I know I have morals, but they don’t come from the fear of a god who might smite, they come from within, they come from empathy and guilt. and through theses, they make compassion possible, thus leading to utilitarianism. There is no god, I am a example, I am responsible.

I even think most people are generally good, we just have contradicting viewpoints, and very limited knowledge(ignorance). A sign that we are good i believe is that we try to justify everything we do.

When did i become an atheist? I took a philosophy class, and thought about it, after long debate, i thought i would become an agnostic, then i thought about it for awhile, now I’m an atheist. There is no empirical evidence for the existence of god, its a matter of faith. ... faith, a word so magical at one time in my life. Faith is an excuse, and once you buy into it, you willingly are jumping into an abyss of unreason.

I’m fascinated by the intelligent design debates. well actually dumbfounded. How can these “moral” people keep shoving dishonest unproved unscientific statements to the table in order to confuse people, and win people over to think that ID is true. The Entropy, 2ndlaw of Thermodynamics,  the DNA mutation of new genetic code and many other are a few examples of the petty nature to scrap believers into their belief for the extra support they need in order to make themselves feel better.

I’m looking forward to debating, discussing and sharing with all of you.

with love-
WITHTEETH

 Signature 

Know Thyself

Profile
 
 
Posted: 29 April 2006 09:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
Administrator
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  15358
Joined  2006-02-14

Hey great to have you here Stephen! Best of luck with your grandmother. Maybe you can recount to her some of the stuff you learned in philosophy class and change her mind.

8)

 Signature 

Doug

-:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:-

El sueño de la razón produce monstruos

Profile
 
 
Posted: 29 April 2006 12:15 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
Sr. Member
RankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  268
Joined  2006-02-08

Re: WITHTEETHS Intro, Hi everyone!

[quote author=“WITHTEETH”]Hello everyone, my actual name is Stephen, I am a student residing in Michigan, and stumbled upon this site last night.

Hi Stephen,
Welcome to these forums.
Bob

Profile
 
 
Posted: 01 May 2006 10:06 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  248
Joined  2005-06-28

Welcome to CFI, Stephen. I am an atheist from Oklahoma.

 Signature 

Fighting the evil belief that there is a god(s).

Profile
 
 
Posted: 07 May 2006 03:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
Jr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2006-04-28

[quote author=“dougsmith”]Hey great to have you here Stephen! Best of luck with your grandmother. Maybe you can recount to her some of the stuff you learned in philosophy class and change her mind.

8)

Talking to my grandmother about philosophy? .... ROFL! Yea philosophy is great coffee talk, my girlfriend is already annoyed at it, do you ever have that problem?

Regardless, I heard a good Sam Harris speech. He said something along the lines of it being taboo is even more of a reason to bring it on. Its better to evaluate then merely respect eachothers beliefs, its not like we respect hitory, or physics! I’m not sure how relevant this is. :D

 Signature 

Know Thyself

Profile
 
 
Posted: 07 May 2006 03:23 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
Administrator
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  15358
Joined  2006-02-14
[quote author=“WITHTEETH”]Talking to my grandmother about philosophy? .... ROFL! Yea philosophy is great coffee talk, my girlfriend is already annoyed at it, do you ever have that problem?

smile Well, there’s a time and place for everything ... and you have to be very careful that you’re not just BSing, but really trying to model what might be TRUE.

I know when I was at university I was doing a lot of BSing in philosophy class ... you know, seeing how weird I could get and still get a good grade.

LOL

[quote author=“WITHTEETH”]Regardless, I heard a good Sam Harris speech. He said something along the lines of it being taboo is even more of a reason to bring it on. Its better to evaluate then merely respect eachothers beliefs, its not like we respect hitory, or physics! I’m not sure how relevant this is. :D

Well, yes and no to Sam Harris. We shouldn’t be shy to confront stupid ideas just because they’re taboo ... See: major religions. But you do have to be slow and careful to be sure that your arguments are sound and not merely annoying.

 Signature 

Doug

-:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:-

El sueño de la razón produce monstruos

Profile
 
 
Posted: 09 May 2006 06:13 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
Sr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  1805
Joined  2005-07-20

Re: WITHTEETHS Intro, Hi everyone!

[quote author=“WITHTEETH”]I am a secular humanist, an atheist. Why
is that a taboo?

Maybe you’re just socializing in the wrong circles?
Maybe you can find or create and attract a better social
circle for youself, through the CFI?  I think that you’re
doing a good thing by thinking in secular humanist terms.
And I wish you well. grin

[quote author=“WITHTEETH”]I’m fascinated by the intelligent
design debates. well actually dumbfounded. How can these
“moral” people keep shoving dishonest unproved unscientific
statements to the table in order to confuse people, and
win people over to think that ID is true.

Even the right-wing Judge Jones pointed out their
dishonesty in the Kitzmiller v. Dover Area School District
ruling.

[quote author=“WITHTEETH”]Yea philosophy is great coffee talk,
my girlfriend is already annoyed at it, do you ever have
that problem?

Well I’m trying to create a philosophy group in
Indianapolis called “Humusings” at a coffee house.  Maybe I
can attract the neo-Beatnik poetry crowd?  Wish me well!
grin

- steve s.

 Signature 

I saw a happy rainbow recently.

Profile
 
 
Posted: 09 May 2006 10:45 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
Jr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2006-04-28

Re: WITHTEETHS Intro, Hi everyone!

[quote author=“jump_in_the_pit”][quote author=“WITHTEETH”]I am a secular humanist, an atheist. Why
is that a taboo?

Maybe you’re just socializing in the wrong circles?
Maybe you can find or create and attract a better social
circle for youself, through the CFI?  I think that you’re
doing a good thing by thinking in secular humanist terms.
And I wish you well. grin

[quote author=“WITHTEETH”]I’m fascinated by the intelligent
design debates. well actually dumbfounded. How can these
“moral” people keep shoving dishonest unproved unscientific
statements to the table in order to confuse people, and
win people over to think that ID is true.

Even the right-wing Judge Jones pointed out their
dishonesty in the Kitzmiller v. Dover Area School District
ruling.

[quote author=“WITHTEETH”]Yea philosophy is great coffee talk,
my girlfriend is already annoyed at it, do you ever have
that problem?

Well I’m trying to create a philosophy group in
Indianapolis called “Humusings” at a coffee house.  Maybe I
can attract the neo-Beatnik poetry crowd?  Wish me well!
grin

- steve s.

A poetry talking philosophy could be very cool, as long as they don’t obsess over death smile

As for socializing in the wrong circles, you may be right. My work area is one of the places I like to relax in and think alot since I have the trade down tightly. My mind is either on autopilot or thinking about this stuff, but every so often I hear my boss or a co-worker say something off beat where I’d like to add my 2-cents.

Heres a long example of my boss coming into work talking about Planned parent hood giving away Free Ipods for an abortion. Both sides of the story: First quoted article was by Anti-choice group, the second is by Planned Parenthood.

Life Decisions International
Planned Parenthood Lures Teens With iPods and Movie Tickets
3.27.2006
 
WASHINGTON, D.C.—Win an iPod. Get two free movie tickets. Take ten dollars off your first visit. These are some of the schemes Planned Parenthood is using to lure teen-agers into its deadly facilities. “Planned Parenthood has resorted to common corporate tactics in an effort to get young people to encourage their peers to voluntarily be-come the pro-abortion group’s new victims,” said Douglas R. Scott, Jr., president of Life Decisions International (LDI). “Just how low and disgusting can Planned Parenthood get?”

Anyone who makes an appointment at one of the eight facilities run by Planned Parenthood Golden Gate (PPGG) before April 30, 2006, can enter to win an iPod. “Now which age group is most likely to be swayed by this kind of gimmick?” Scott asked. “This incentive is clearly aimed at young people.”

 

Planned Parenthood Golden Gate
Press Releases
Planned Parenthood Golden Gate Brings Safe is Sexy Message to MySpace Generation
Safe Sex Outreach Meets Youth on Their Own Turf with an iPod Giveaway and Ads on MTV, KMEL Radio and MySpace.com

April 14, 2006

SAN FRANCISCO-Planned Parenthood Golden Gate (PPGG) is working to educate the Bay Area’s youth on reproductive health and safety by meeting them on their own turf with a mix of modern media and traditional word of mouth outreach.  It is PPGG’s goal to help teens and young adults make educated, responsible decisions when it comes to their sexuality and reproductive health.  In order to connect as many youth as possible with reproductive health services and information, PPGG has designed an outreach campaign that includes advertising on MySpace.com, KMEL radio and MTV. Through a grassroots “Tell a Friend” campaign, youth who refer friends to PPGG receive movie tickets and are eligible to win an iPod in a raffle. Street teams are handing out thousands of safe sex packs containing condoms and information on PPGG health services at college campuses, house parties and gyms. PPGG is also working on incorporating youth driven technologies like text messaging into its advocacy outreach and appointment scheduling systems.

“Our goal at Planned Parenthood is to reach as many teens and young adults as possible with our safe is sexy message,” said Dian Harrison, President and CEO of Planned Parenthood Golden Gate.  “Studies have shown that young people typically seek information from their peers.  The social network, online and off, is one of the best ways to get our safety and prevention message out. Every aspect of this outreach is designed to get people talking.”

 

After reading both of these articles its obvious that one of them is overstepping its boundaries, and has their story scewed. The Anti choicers bascially say, have an abortion, get a free iPod at planned parenthood is an abomination. On the other hand, Planned Parenthood:Golden Gate program is saying this is about teaching the youth about their medical reproductive systems and safe sex.

So obviously the Anti Choices have an axe to grind, because they don’t think sex can be fun, if its consented sex you must have a child(thats what I’ve heard from a pastor).  And stopping abortions all together is their goal regardless of the consequences of their self rightous actions.

Planned Parenthoods plan is to help reduce abortions by teaching the youth about sex, because regardless, young people are going to have sex! The more they are aware about themselves, the better they will be able to prevent a pregnancy Planned Parenthood Golden Gates says. The free iPods were donated to them by a group that just wanted to help the youth learn more, and thought this would attract them. Churches have been prostituting the youth for ages, by chasing them with naightmares about eternal hell and suffering, while glorifying living in a utopian wonderland in the clouds.

RICHMOND TOWNSHIP - Macomb County Prosecutor Eric Smith said his hands were tied when it came time to decide whom to charge in the baseball bat beating death of a fetus being carried by a teenage girl.

He decided Tuesday to do the only thing one state statute allowed: charge the boyfriend who wielded the bat, hitting his girlfriend in the stomach repeatedly over a two-week period, but let the girl off the hook, uncharged.

The Richmond Township boy, 16, who may be arraigned as early as today in Macomb County Juvenile Court, is at home with his parents. He was charged as a juvenile with intentional conduct against a pregnancy or stillbirth, which is a felony. If convicted, he could remain in custody until age 21.

But the girl, also from Richmond - who was a willing participant in the induced abortion, law enforcement officials say - cannot be charged under that law because it specifically excludes the mother from criminal liability.

In part because it still was legal to abort the fetus, the decision renewed debate over the protection of fetuses and the fairness of charging just one of two juveniles who allegedly agreed to kill their unborn child.

 
This is what happens when you ban abortion, or you allow yourself to get so wrapped up in yourself you stop thinking about the youth of today. They couldn’t even go to their parents because of their adults belief. This is why planned parenthood needs to be around, to help our youth when parents aren’t their to support or understand. It may be their children, but its the rest of the adolecents life. :/

I’ve heard many things behind my back about the way I think about morality, religion, faith, and my humanistic perspective, I don’t let it get to me, it really just makes it all that more interesting to observe the people who know me.

Alot of religious mumbo jumbo gets thrown arouind at work (even though it shouldn’t)  and sometimes its directed towards me. One time I saw a statue of a white elephant buddha and told a coworker the story about how buddha was the catalyst of his own birth. He replied with “Sounds like nothing I would want to believe, huh!” well, jesus was the catalyst of his own birth too, so that made for an interesting conversation.

 Signature 

Know Thyself

Profile
 
 
Posted: 10 May 2006 01:37 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
Administrator
Avatar
RankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRankRank
Total Posts:  15358
Joined  2006-02-14

Excellent stuff, WITHTEETH. Planned Parenthood does great work informing youth about reproductive alternatives, and making them available. They’re doing a heck of a lot of good, and certainly deserve all our support.

One of the greatest evils of modern religion is its willful misunderstanding about sex, birth control and reproduction. The distortions and lies in that piece you mention are really too awful, but its all of a piece with right-wing Christian demagoguery.

So what’d your coworker say about Jesus’s birth?

:wink:

This is from Tom Paine’s book The Age of Reason: “What is it the bible teaches us? Rapine, cruelty and murder. What is it the testament teaches us? To believe that the Almighty committed debauchery with a woman engaged to be married; and the belief of this debauchery is called faith.” (p. 822 in the Library of America volume). Strong stuff!

Paine is pretty incredible ... and to think he was one of our Founding Fathers!

 Signature 

Doug

-:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:- -:—:-

El sueño de la razón produce monstruos

Profile
 
 
Posted: 10 May 2006 12:56 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
Jr. Member
Avatar
RankRankRank
Total Posts:  51
Joined  2006-04-28

[quote author=“dougsmith”]Excellent stuff, WITHTEETH. Planned Parenthood does great work informing youth about reproductive alternatives, and making them available. They’re doing a heck of a lot of good, and certainly deserve all our support.

One of the greatest evils of modern religion is its willful misunderstanding about sex, birth control and reproduction. The distortions and lies in that piece you mention are really too awful, but its all of a piece with right-wing Christian demagoguery.

So what’d your coworker say about Jesus’s birth?

:wink:

This is from Tom Paine’s book The Age of Reason: “What is it the bible teaches us? Rapine, cruelty and murder. What is it the testament teaches us? To believe that the Almighty committed debauchery with a woman engaged to be married; and the belief of this debauchery is called faith.” (p. 822 in the Library of America volume). Strong stuff!

Paine is pretty incredible ... and to think he was one of our Founding Fathers!

Nice quote! smileI’ve heard someone else put it like this on NPR once:
“God creates people imperfect, then blames them for being imperfect.Then sends his son to be murdered by these same people, to make up for how imperfect those pople were, and how imperfect they will inevitably be!”
Or to think about it differently, he sacrifices himself to himself… Weird stuff. :?

My Co worker after I told him about jesus being a catalyst to his own birth   said yes but Jesus was real atleast, so I asked him to prove it, then he asked me to prove Socrates, but my whole reality does not need socrates existance i told him, Its not that he existed its his message. So I put the burden back on to him, and he gave me alot of “proof” like the bible, and the impact of christianity on the world. I didn’t consider any of it proof to myself, but it is clearly good enough for him. I should have asked him if it just came down to faith now that i think about it, ohwell.

Its always weird talking about this when you know your boss is an outstanding member of an orthodox church who takes the bible as the literal word of god. But surprisingly he doesn’t try to convert anyone, hes a good guy, its just his viewpoint on social issues really disturb me and Its because of the religion.

I took a comparative religion class College, thats how I know the story behind Buddha, we actually had to do a comparison between Buddha and Jesus which I never really thought would be so similar, pretty cool stuff! Its fascinating to learn about peoples core beliefs, and how they arised.

Have any of you taken any classes that you really felt you got alot out of?

 Signature 

Know Thyself

Profile
 
 
   
 
 
‹‹ Jimmie Keyes      hello from Massachusetts ››