Excommunication for researchers?
Posted: 30 June 2006 07:00 PM   [ Ignore ]
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Here’s a neat piece of news, from today’s today’s New York Times ... (registration probably necessary, and only available for a few days).

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[b:c4ab0c36f6]Excommunication Is Sought for Stem Cell Researchers[/b:c4ab0c36f6]

By ELISABETH ROSENTHAL
Published: July 1, 2006
ROME, June 30 Scientists who engage in stem cell research using human embryos should be subject to excommunication from the Roman Catholic Church, according to a senior Vatican official.

Cardinal Alfonso Lpez Trujillo, who heads the group that proposes family-related policy for the church, said in an interview with the Catholic weekly Famiglia Cristiana published Thursday that stem cell researchers should be punished in the same way as women who have abortions and doctors who perform them. ...

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Now why someone would be a Catholic and involved in such cutting-edge scientific research is something of a mystery to me, but be that as it may, this is crazy.

Or perhaps I should look to my Avatar’s experiences with the church when he claimed that the earth went around the sun?

:wink:

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Posted: 30 June 2006 07:00 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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Excommunication for researchers?

Here’s a neat piece of news, from today’s today’s New York Times ... (registration probably necessary, and only available for a few days).

———————————-

Excommunication Is Sought for Stem Cell Researchers

By ELISABETH ROSENTHAL
Published: July 1, 2006
ROME, June 30—Scientists who engage in stem cell research using human embryos should be subject to excommunication from the Roman Catholic Church, according to a senior Vatican official.

Cardinal Alfonso Lpez Trujillo, who heads the group that proposes family-related policy for the church, said in an interview with the Catholic weekly Famiglia Cristiana published Thursday that stem cell researchers should be punished in the same way as women who have abortions and doctors who perform them. ...

————————-

Now why someone would be a Catholic and involved in such cutting-edge scientific research is something of a mystery to me, but be that as it may, this is crazy.

Or perhaps I should look to my Avatar’s experiences with the church when he claimed that the earth went around the sun?

:wink:

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Doug

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Posted: 30 June 2006 10:19 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Re: Excommunication for researchers?

doug,
  It definitely is crazy.
Bob

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Posted: 06 July 2006 12:37 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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Catholics are not known for their intelligence.

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Fighting the evil belief that there is a god(s).

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Posted: 06 July 2006 08:43 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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[quote author=“theatheistheretic”]Catholics are not known for their intelligence.

Well now, I’m not sure I’d agree with that. Some very intelligent people can get taken in by even the wildest of religious claims. Even Isaac Newton (arguably the most intelligent person who ever lived) spent the last years of his life on Biblical exigesis.

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Posted: 07 July 2006 02:15 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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I’m a Catholic!! Fallen Away but nevertheless if someone asked on a form I might say Roman Catholic, specially if I was being admitted to a Catholic hospital in Minnesota.

So AH you just called me a dummy!!

Jim

If that’s not the greatest straight line written since Hope asked Crosby “How do I look?” walking away from him to the front of the stage, I’ll give up writing them.

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Posted: 08 July 2006 08:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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Re: Excommunication for researchers?

Hi Doug,

[quote author=“dougsmith”]Now why someone would be a Catholic and involved in such cutting-edge scientific research is something of a mystery to me, but be that as it may, this is crazy. :wink:

I think that the final bastion of the Catholic Church is “SEX and the WOMAN’S WOMB”. If the Catholic Church has to give up on these two issues it might as well close up shop.

Take any issue involving sex and you will realise the Catholic Church is dogmatic now as it was over 1,500 years ago. It prefers even to look stupid, such as the Pope banning condom use even in marriage where a partner may have aids.

The Catholic Church has realised that to give even an inch would make it no different than any other Christian sect changing religious laws in line with modern “scientific morality”.

It therefore becomes doubly important for us to push science and scientist to expand on stem cell research and cloning. Who knows the future might record these two scientific advancements as the defining theories that broke the pillars of the Catholic Church.

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Fayzal Mahamed,
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Posted: 08 July 2006 10:51 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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Yes, Fayzal, I also feel that the Catholic church is worried about appearing to waver, appearing not to be “infallible”, and so it carries on with policies that are obviously false, hurtful and immoral for so many people, particularly people in the third world who require birth control and AIDS advice.

It’s a very bad situation.

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Posted: 08 July 2006 11:13 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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I only wish somehow we could do something about it> Did you see the comment that Stephen Hawkins reported that Pope John Paul had said he wanted him not to investigate the beginning of the universe.
Of course he was presenting a paper about exactly that to the meeting the Pope spoke to him at.
Jim

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Jimmie Keyes
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Posted: 08 July 2006 12:54 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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Re: What Hawking reported

jim,
I saw that report by Hawking. Pope John Paul said something similar to Stephen Jay Gould. He said it was ok for scientists to try to go back as far as The “Big Bang” but they shouldn’t try to find out what happened before the Big Bang. He said that was the domain of God and it wasn’t right to go there.
Bob

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Posted: 08 July 2006 08:13 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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More silliness from the Popes ...

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Posted: 08 July 2006 08:36 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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Re: The Popes

doug,
Yes, they certainly are silly.
Bob

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Posted: 09 July 2006 01:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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Remember this about the recent ones, they have bought into evolution, and I guess that’s a good thing. so with all the marks against them, aids, women and childbirth, stem cells, cloning, there seems to be one on the side of what’s right a good.
Jim

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Posted: 20 July 2006 12:29 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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Well that’s not that unusual. Canonical laws require automatic excommunication for people sexually abused by clergy who the bring formal charges. The automatic excommunication can only be stayed on a direct order from the pope.

This is true of course with any apostate Catholics as well.

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Posted: 20 July 2006 02:07 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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[quote author=“cgallaga”]Canonical laws require automatic excommunication for people sexually abused by clergy who the bring formal charges. The automatic excommunication can only be stayed on a direct order from the pope.

Really?? What is the reasoning behind this decision?

Has the pope ever stayed any of these excommunications?

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Posted: 20 July 2006 02:39 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimen_sollicitationis

Crimen sollicitationis is a secret document issued by the Holy Office of the Vatican (now the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith) in 1962, instructing bishops about how to handle cases in which priests were accused of using the privacy of the confessional to make sexual advances to penitents. The document also instructs bishops on how to handle cases of the “worst crime”, in which a priest is sexually involved with an animal, child, or man. Canon lawyers disagree about the extent to which the document is still in force.

The document calls for such cases to be handled in secret, and extends that secrecy to the document itself. The document imposes secrecy even upon victims of sexual abuse. Extreme penalties for violations of secrecy, including excommunication that can only be dismissed by the pope himself, are imposed. Perhaps as a result, some bishops claim not to have known of its existence.

The law itself is quite old, my guess is the reason was to avoid scandal by threat of excommunication. I’m not sure about stays from the pope.

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