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Why liberals should vote this election
Posted: 14 September 2010 08:46 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 16 ]
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citizenschallenge.pm - 14 September 2010 08:31 AM
Chigonzo - 13 September 2010 06:08 PM

Not that it matters, but I will vote for mostly Green Party members. My friends may continue to vote for Democrats calling them “the lesser evil,” but I will walk away from the polls knowing I voted for an atheist.

Vote Rich Whitney for Governor of Illinois!

Well, I’m for the Green Party and trying to shake things up, but given how our government is made up, sometimes one just has to be pragmatic - that perhaps a vote for the third party is a vote for a very bad candidate - such as happen with Nader in 2000 - he used to be my hero but now he has just as much blood on his hands as all the rest. A vote for Nader turned out to be a vote for Bush in many places… bad, bad mistake we will never overcome or make right.

That’s why I wish voters would get more serious and realistic and involved.

If one only supports the Greens, or a third party, one day out of 730 days I think its counter productive.

I couldn’t agree more! As a journalist I have had the privilege of meeting most of the candidates I will be voting for (and plenty that I won’t). Overall, the Green Party lacks organization and funding. While this is somewhat depressing for me, I have always been in favor of the underdog.

I realize that votes will be lost for Democrats if the Greens ever get their act together, despite this I will be one of the few voting and donating to the Greens because most of the Green candidates I have met, are actually concerned with improving our local government. They often will try to guide Republicans and Democrats into taking their views so they don’t lose the votes.

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Posted: 14 September 2010 09:34 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 17 ]
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I can certainly understand your feelings, but the thought of turning the country back to the Gingrich, Palin, Boehner, McConnell cabal nauseates me so much that I cannot cast a vote that might help them take over.

Occam

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Posted: 14 September 2010 09:49 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 18 ]
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Occam. - 14 September 2010 09:34 AM

I can certainly understand your feelings, but the thought of turning the country back to the Gingrich, Palin, Boehner, McConnell cabal nauseates me so much that I cannot cast a vote that might help them take over.

Occam

Yes, I can agree that nothing would be worse than that. I always hear people say “love it or leave it,” Palin makes me want to cross multiple borders .

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Posted: 14 September 2010 05:08 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 19 ]
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I think I would want to try a system were the public only voted on a local level. City legislators would vote on the county level… etc. And the State legislators would vote on the federal level.

Thing is the public really doesn’t know the person they are voting for the presidency. They really have no idea if the person would make a good elected official except by the perception provided by political campaigns.

Our current system makes the presidency a crap shoot. However the people running are more likely to deal directly with on the state level of government. They’d have have a better understanding of who these people are.

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Posted: 14 September 2010 05:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 20 ]
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That’s roughly how Technocracy was supposed to work. Can’t say whether it’s a good idea or not.

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Posted: 14 September 2010 06:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 21 ]
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It was also done at the beginning of this country.  That was the function of the Electoral College.  However, that system would just allow a whole set of levels into which corruption could be introduced.  And as one congressional representative said when being interviewed by someone from the Daily Show about two years ago, when asked why a number of congressmen had done something stupid, “Well, there’s no IQ test reaquirement for being elected to public office.”

If we had really good universal elementary and secondary education, made sure everyone had to pass all the tests before they could graduate, and not allow dropouts, but be sure that kids got adequate food, and didn’t have to work outside school, etc., then we could have about a thousand questions covering the Constitution, government in general, and current government events in a computer program.  Institute a $100 fine for not showing up at the polls, sign in, then answer, say, twenty multiple choice questions the computer randomly selected.  If one didn’t get a passing score of, say, 70% one’s vote would be deleted.  That way, we’d have more aware voters, so possibly we’d actually get intelligent politicians. 

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Posted: 14 September 2010 07:21 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 22 ]
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Yup Occam,
a healthy democracy requires an educated, informed and interested public.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~
This reminding me of another post I wanted to reply to, but, too much time passed and I didn’t want to drag that thread back to the top of the list.

Occam. - 30 August 2010 06:19 PM

Quote CC:

helping the kids to figure out things for themselves, to learn critical thinking, and to develop creativity.” needs to start well before school does.

  I agree, CC, but if parents are incapable of doing that, I’d like to see the schools make some effort in that direction rather than DM’s description.

Occam

Occam,

aah, therein lies the rub…  downward spiral.
Schools can help make up for some of the lack of help at home, but only some of it.

Or more tragically, all those parents who would love nothing better than to spend such one on one study time with their young children - but work, or separation, or who knows what creates a insurmountable barriers to that dream, and then time passes so quickly, then we are left with the consequences.

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Posted: 06 October 2010 11:53 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 23 ]
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Well, I got to read it in print in the Four Corners Free Press.
Their editor did a marvelous job of touching it up, while taking another 50 words off of it.
Last night after studying her edits, I did a little more myself and got it down 805 now.

Now if only I could find others interested in printing it - it’s there for the taking.

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Posted: 17 October 2010 06:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 24 ]
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citizenschallenge.pm - 09 September 2010 07:46 AM

May I suggest a simple, left v. right distinction between people… voters?....

(a) this belongs in politics and social issues - not general discussion.

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Posted: 18 October 2010 07:32 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 25 ]
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In many ways The Tea Party can be viewed as the current manifestation of the populist movement of the 1890s.  William Jennings Bryan gave to Cross of Gold speech in reaction to a financial crisis that to today’s with similar impact on small town and the working class, and as I assume you all know, was a strong opponent of evolutionary theory.  The populists of that time leaned to the Democratic Party as the Republicans were the party in power.  They were a strong enough political force that Jennings was appointed Secretary of State by Wilson, who later fired him for opposing US entry into WWI.  It will be interesting to see how this current opposition to the entrenched interests plays out over the next few years.

[ Edited: 19 October 2010 08:45 AM by garythehuman ]
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Posted: 18 October 2010 07:47 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 26 ]
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Gnostkosis

I think I would want to try a system were the public only voted on a local level. City legislators would vote on the county level… etc. And the State legislators would vote on the federal level

I am not in favor of that. 

Let me give you a personal experience.  I moved into my current residence two & a half years ago.  After I moved in I found out my local village trustee was a man I went to high school with, and I worked with his father,  several of his cousins & uncles at the foundry for years.  This man had been an outstanding center of the High-Scholl basket-ball team, and was being considered for a scholarship for Notre Dame, until they found out his scholastic average was in the low 50s, that he had two women pregnant.  He didn’t finish his senior year as he was tossed out of school for fighting on the School Superintendents front lawn with boys from a rival school (which is now the jurisdiction he now represents).  Later on he went into managing in Harness Racing, (his fathers weakness was gambling) and was banned from it for life for drugging the ponies and fixing races.  The people in this district are dumb enough to elect him.  I don’t want anyone of this type influencing the higher levels of government in any way.

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Posted: 18 October 2010 07:52 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 27 ]
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I am considering voting “Green” in this election as Cuomo appears to have the N.Y. State governors race sewed up, and the Green party is working for permanent ballot status, I think it is important that the this viewpoint is heard, and not just on environmental issues.

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Posted: 18 October 2010 08:05 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 28 ]
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garythehuman - 18 October 2010 07:52 AM

I am considering voting “Green” in this election as Cuomo appears to have the N.Y. State governors race sewed up, and the Green party is working for permanent ballot status, I think it is important that the this viewpoint is heard, and not just on environmental issues.

I agree that supporting Greens and other third party types is valuable - but there is the pragmatic part, that you do acknowledge.
Going back to 2000, on one level I fully supported Ralph Nader’s efforts, but near the end when it became obvious Nader would turn into a spoiler… back stabber, so far as the choice America was being offered {rational, if flawed, approach vs. faith-based corporate approach} the man should have used his political chips worked out some sort of understanding with the Dems and supported candidate Gore in winning the election. Think of the power he could have achieved, thus influencing later Democratic decisions.

Instead he played the greedy dog looking into the river and obsessing over that other dogs bone.
From hero to someone deserving contempt.
Nader only succeeded in blooding his own hands and becoming a political joke. stupid, stupid, stupid.

And such an ugly turning point in America and the world’s history.

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Posted: 18 October 2010 08:16 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 29 ]
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Jackson - 17 October 2010 06:18 PM
citizenschallenge.pm - 09 September 2010 07:46 AM

May I suggest a simple, left v. right distinction between people… voters?....

(a) this belongs in politics and social issues - not general discussion.

Moved.

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Posted: 18 October 2010 08:44 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 30 ]
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garythehuman - 18 October 2010 07:47 AM

I am not in favor of that. 

Let me give you a personal experience.  I moved into my current residence two & a half years ago.  After I moved in I found out my local village trustee was a man I went to high school with, and I worked with his father,  several of his cousins & uncles at the foundry for years.  This man had been an outstanding center of the High-Scholl basket-ball team, and was being considered for a scholarship for Notre Dame, until they found out his scholastic average was in the low 50s, that he had two women pregnant.  He didn’t finish his senior year as he was tossed out of school for fighting on the School Superintendents front lawn with boys from a rival school (which is now the jurisdiction he now represents).  Later on he went into managing in Harness Racing, (his fathers weakness was gambling) and was banned from it for life for drugging the ponies and fixing races.  The people in this district are dumb enough to elect him.  I don’t want anyone of this type influencing the higher levels of government in any way.

Well, one thing, you know the guy. Second, all the people in your district vote for and influence your state representative anyway.

Although I think there is not much difference in this and what we have now. Just that too many don’t bother to understand the issues or really know the politicians.

A politician only has to offer platitudes and meaningless promises to get elected.

Personally I refuse to vote for either major party, probably a bad idea in that I may overlook an otherwise good candidate. However I think both major parties are part of the problem. So IMO a candidate that supports one of the major two parties also supports the problem.

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