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4th-Grade Textbook Claims “Thousands Of Blacks” Fought For Confederacy
Posted: 20 October 2010 11:56 AM   [ Ignore ]
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Civil War scholars say, “Umm, no.  No they did not.”  Who do you believe?  The historians or the textbook’s author who is a “fairly respected author” who did her research primarily on the internet.  I’m sure you can see who is in the right here.

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Posted: 20 October 2010 01:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]
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Well, if it was on the internet, on a Confederate site….it must be true!(NOT!) Yet another example of Virginia twisting it’s antebellum history.

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Posted: 20 October 2010 01:33 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]
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Dead Monky - 20 October 2010 11:56 AM

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Civil War scholars say, “Umm, no.  No they did not.”  Who do you believe?  The historians or the textbook’s author who is a “fairly respected author” who did her research primarily on the internet. I’m sure you can see who is in the right here.

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Posted: 20 October 2010 05:16 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]
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I can believe that “Thousands of Blacks” were drafted into th Confederate army, but what would be more important would be to learn how many of them defected to the other side or went AWOL as soon as they could.

Occam

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Posted: 20 October 2010 05:53 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]
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Dead Monky - 20 October 2010 11:56 AM

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Civil War scholars say, “Umm, no.  No they did not.”  Who do you believe?  The historians or the textbook’s author who is a “fairly respected author” who did her research primarily on the internet.  I’m sure you can see who is in the right here.

I wish we could get Al Sharptons non-biased viewpoint on this one. LOL

Edit

I wanted to point out that I heard that not all slaves thought they had bad lives. Most of the people had gotten use to the lifestyle and just went on with it. Before people get up in arms about it. I’ll immediately say that this doesn’t make it right, but my point being. That many slaves could have fought against the North not fully realizing what’s going on. Most would have thought that fighting the north as a way to defending their families.

[ Edited: 20 October 2010 05:57 PM by ExMachina ]
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Posted: 20 October 2010 06:07 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]
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ExMachina - 20 October 2010 05:53 PM
Dead Monky - 20 October 2010 11:56 AM

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Civil War scholars say, “Umm, no.  No they did not.”  Who do you believe?  The historians or the textbook’s author who is a “fairly respected author” who did her research primarily on the internet.  I’m sure you can see who is in the right here.

I wish we could get Al Sharptons non-biased viewpoint on this one. LOL

Great point Ex Machina! The blacks were not allowed to fight for The North at first either. Certainly some thousands of blacks fought for the Confederates in one capacity or another, willingly or otherwise. This is known fact.
At the very end of the war the South was desperate enough to raise a few companies of Black soldiers…but it was too late.
Louisiana also had numbers of Free Blacks who were willing to fight for the confederacy. Some Blacks had slaves too. Not every black in the South was a slave. Some had managed to identify with the Confederacy.
We can be sure that some blacks did fight on the Confederate side, using this as grist to prove an ideological point, or to point out that blacks were somehow “patriotic” about the South is ridiculous though.

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Posted: 20 October 2010 07:35 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]
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Looking back at my own family history, I can believe that there WERE some slaves fighting for the Confederacy.They were probably told that the Union Army would slaughter their wives and eat their babies. Many, many went over to the Union Army to fight. My guess is that the ratio would be roughly 1000:1 joining the Union:Confederacy. I have a couple of black relatives who owned slaves and I cannot find where they joined the Confederate Army, and while I can find a good half dozen fighting for the Union, the only person fighting for the Confederacy in my family was white. He left his free black wife at home to fight and returned home to her after the war…

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Posted: 21 October 2010 01:09 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]
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Whose going to remember history from 4th grade by the time they graduate from high school anyway?

Who cares if it’s wrong?  They didn’t tell us Henry Ford donated to the NAZI party in the 1920s.  Wouldn’t it be really strange if Hitler hadn’t come to power if it weren’t for Ford?

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Posted: 21 October 2010 03:22 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]
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While one may not remember the particulars, the general concepts we pick up in the earlier grades have a great deal to do with our attitudes and general beliefs as adults. 

I’ll bet that if the relationship between Henry Ford and the Nazi party had been taught to elementary school kids in the 30s and 40s, they may have forgotten that but I’ll be that quite a few of them, as adults, would have avoided buying Ford vehicles.

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Posted: 21 October 2010 05:08 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]
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Occam. - 21 October 2010 03:22 PM

While one may not remember the particulars, the general concepts we pick up in the earlier grades have a great deal to do with our attitudes and general beliefs as adults.

That is why they should be encouraged to read SCIENTIFIC science fiction in grade school.

Way more fun than history.  LOL

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Posted: 21 October 2010 06:42 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]
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Well, I didn’t start to read SF until the seventh grade.  Before then I divided my reading between kid’s science books from the library and comic books. 
And it all depends on the kinds of teachers they have.  In jr. & sr. highschool I happened to have weak history teachers but excellent civics teachers.  I still don’t care for history.  Fortunately, since it merges with political science I’m not a complete illiterate there. 

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Posted: 22 October 2010 03:28 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]
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I think I started reading sci-fi in around sixth grade.  I’m pretty sure that’s when I picked up my first BattleTech book.  Though I did do a diorama/book report on 20,000 Leagues Under The Sea In 2nd grade.  I had the squid swinging little construction paper people around, the teacher loved it.

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Posted: 22 October 2010 06:32 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]
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I started out by reading mythologies in the 4th grade. I started reading science fiction in high school. I swiped some of my brother’s books when I couldn’t find anything else to read. I’m trying to remember the name of the first book I read…

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Posted: 23 October 2010 12:21 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]
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I freely admit I don’t know what the truth is here but I have always understood that blacks were enslaved in the South and not (except perhaps by poverty/class) in the North and, more recently, that the Civil War wasn’t a moral war but, like most wars seem to be, about economics/resources because the South could manufacture things more cheaply due to their slave labour.

Whether any of that is true is debatable but what’s really interesting to me is the apparent attempt to rewrite history ... it’s happened in Germany, in the Vatican, happens all the time with major historic characters (one of my key reasons for rejecting claims about Gandhi, Mother Teresa & Jesus) and, whilst I can’t think of any specific claims involving my own country, I’m damned sure they’ve done it too. I even see it in film, TV & written fiction ... in a recent BBC series about “Casanova” one of the prime characters lady associates was gorgeous and black (I never watched it because I found the idea of rewriting history to be politically correct offensive ... well that & the fact that it wasn’t my kind of series), I also watch “Merlin” on the BBC and find it slightly “odd” that Guinevere (at this point still a servant) is black ... she’s a pretty damned competent actress but let’s be honest about this, Guinevere would have been some kind of European woman (presumably British even if Britain didn’t exist then). It may not seem much (and it isn’t racist at all) but in fiction the children’s book “Noddy” has reputedly been withdrawn and rewritten so that Noddy, who apparently was a little cruel to Big Ears, no longer is ... I’d rather the books were simply withdrawn and left to act as a reminder of how we were than altered to deny that.

Despite accusations made (and I say that because those who have claimed so have yet to withdraw their baseless assertions) I am not, to my knowledge (religions excepted though that is more a general antagonism than specific to any one), bigoted and any tendency I ever note in myself that veer that way I try to counter through reason and logic. I’m right up there for not portraying ethnic/cultural/other minorities in stereotyped roles but NOT at the cost of historical denial or political correctness ... I just think that there is a better lesson to be learned from seeing our mistakes, knowing that we did things poorly before and should do better in the future than the lesson taught by re-framing it (a.k.a. sweeping it under the carpet and denying it ever happened).

It’s a view.

Keke

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Posted: 23 October 2010 12:43 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]
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Kyuuketsuki UK - 23 October 2010 12:21 AM

I freely admit I don’t know what the truth is here but I have always understood that blacks were enslaved in the South and not (except perhaps by poverty/class) in the North and, more recently, that the Civil War wasn’t a moral war but, like most wars seem to be, about economics/resources because the South could manufacture things more cheaply due to their slave labour.

Pretty succinct synopsis. It was never about slavery. Even the emancipation proclamation was designed only to weaken the Confederacy. And since the Confederate states had seceded, it could not be enforced.

I’m right up there for not portraying ethnic/cultural/other minorities in stereotyped roles but NOT at the cost of historical denial or political correctness ... I just think that there is a better lesson to be learned from seeing our mistakes, knowing that we did things poorly before and should do better in the future than the lesson taught by re-framing it (a.k.a. sweeping it under the carpet and denying it ever happened).
It’s a view.
Keke

I agree with you on that. It reminds me of US revisionist history which would change blacks to white when telling stories. I was amazed to find out that (for instance) Bill Pickett the bull wrangler was actually black. He was always played by whites in the movies when I was a child. And he was very black, with dark brown skin. When I was a child, I could look through the encyclopedia, and there were a number of black inventors and scientist which would have no picture and no notation that they were African American. This gave my HS teachers the confidence to state that with few exceptions, blacks had accomplished nothing of note since they were brought to the USA in the 1640s.

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Posted: 23 October 2010 08:58 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]
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Dead Monky - 20 October 2010 11:56 AM

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Civil War scholars say, “Umm, no.  No they did not.”  Who do you believe?  The historians or the textbook’s author who is a “fairly respected author” who did her research primarily on the internet.  I’m sure you can see who is in the right here.

Slavery is wrong of course so whether blacks fought for confederacy or not—what’s the point? 

Here is an example on the internet [EDITED link—*.htm not *.html]
http://www.civilwarhome.com/blacks.htm

This Prof. Edward Smith sounds odd.
http://cwmemory.com/2010/06/10/edward-c-smith-on-black-confederates/
http://www.american.edu/cas/faculty/esmith.cfm

[ Edited: 23 October 2010 12:51 PM by Jackson ]
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