Re: The Final Freedoms
[quote author=“klatu”]Downloading takes only a few seconds with most broadband connections. To study the material will take some time, some effort and interest. If your only looking to debunk it, you won’t find anything anyway. Why waste your time?
It’s a good question; however, I think you misunderstand our mission here. We like to critique things like the material you brought. That is, to put it to the test of reason and evidence and see if it passes. You have come with a lot of extraordinary claims for your bit of writing. Well, we all know from reading our Carl Sagan that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.
So, we’re here to investigate and look for the evidence.
On this same topic, I note that the .pdf file is free for the taking, however it is locked from reproduction and apparently doesn’t show up in internet searches. Why the secrecy? Are you intending to sell this thing eventually?
[quote author=“klatu”]But not knowing your intentions, and offering some small measure of benefit of doubt, you might try starting with the chapter ‘Perfect Faith’, followed by ‘Test of the Human Heart’.
OK, here’s how I look at these sections. They are filled with unsupported claims about miracles, god and his aims. Let’s take a few in succession, first from “Perfect Faith”:
[quote author=“Final Freedoms document”]Serious discussion of signs and miracles may appear strange in modern times, as there has been nothing available to mankind, for almost two thousand years, that measures up to the vision, which the language of scripture holds out to mankind as proof of ultimate reality. (p. 40)
So ... what evidence do you have that these miracles happened 2,000 years ago? One would assume you will look to so-called holy books like the Bible. But why do you think the Bible is factually accurate? If you think it is accurate, what about the other so-called holy books, or books of myth, from around the world, up to and including in our present day, that claim miracles happened? (The Mahabharata, Iliad, Odyssey, Popol Vuh, etc.) For a ‘latter day’ book, what about the Book of Mormon, for example?
Further, what exact “proof of ultimate reality” are you talking about? Where is this “proof”?
[quote author=“Final Freedoms document”]God alone has determined the means and way, explained by this revelation, whereby the moral quality and purposeful nature of the divine will, should be discovered as a perfectly objective experience of the power of the living God. (p. 40)
Umm, and just how do you know that god has done all these things? Why should we believe you? George Bush says god told him to invade Iraq. I doubt you believe that god told him any such thing.
... and then there’s the background question, Why do you believe that god exists? What evidence do you have that a perfectly good, all knowing, all powerful being exists or created the universe?
The other section you mention (Test of the Human Heart) doesn’t exist; I have to assume you meant to direct me to the “Test of the Human Spirit”. Here it says things such as:
[quote author=“Final Freedoms document”]In his wisdom the living God has chosen this time and commanded this revelation of perfect truth be published; the apostasy of history, which is everything calling itself Christian to be exposed for the fraud that it is. Thereby to provide humankind with a perfect means to measure for all claims of religious understanding. (p. 53)
OK, I assume you directed me to this passage because it is anti-Christian. But first, how do you know that ‘the living God’ has done these things? What evidence do you provide? I can’t see any. Second, if your religion is so great, why is Christianity a “fraud”?
The problem with this document from stem to stern, as I said before, is that it is simply one grandiose, irrational, unsupported claim followed by another.